DIR- Generic 2 left hip D-rings for stage diving

[elgoog]

TL;DR - Added a 2nd D-ring on my left hip as I was fumbling a lot with clipping a stage on the same one as the SPG. Seems to work really well with 1 stage but want to make sure this is not going to cause any unforeseen problems in the future if/when I get to a point where I'm diving 2+ stages.

Hi all -

My primary diving is with a DPV from shore and I recently started diving with a stage so I could dive the farther out sites in the reserve. We use this as a bottom stage, breathing the stage down first and continuing and ending the dive on backgas. EAN32 everywhere.

I find it super hard to stow the stage reg on an empty and floaty AL80 so have to pretty much unclip the hip snap, have the bottle out in front of me and stow the reg there. The problem I'm facing is when clipping it back in to my left hip. Since it's this floaty, it's invariably a fight and I end up clipping it pretty much everywhere but where I'm aiming .i.e. on the D-ring and above the SPG snap. So far, I've managed to clip it to the SPG snap gate, SPG snap thumb loop and, occasionally, on the D-ring but below the SPG snap. I also wasn't able to clip back my SPG snap as easily because of the stage.

For a dive yesterday, I added a 2nd D-ring on the left side. I used the one closer to the backplate for the SPG and the one in the front for the stage. This worked really well for me and I'd like to keep it this way. The reason for this post is to see if there are any potential issues with this setup in the future when you add more bottles or get to a point where you start using a leash. Also, any cave specific concerns? With my diving interests now, I'm more likely to get in this multi bottle scenario in a cave rather than ocean.
I don't want to get in a situation where I've built muscle memory and grown to rely on something that's gonna be a problem later.

If it makes any difference at all, I clip my SPG snap in a back to front motion and the stage bottle front to back.

For reference, I did GUE Rec 3 (yes, I know - pitchforks ) to learn stage bottle use and associated procedures so everything I'm doing is based on that. Also, to improve my atrocious ascents but that's another story ...

Thanks in advance,
elgoog

 

[_Ralph]

Is there a reason why you are clipping the two different clips in different fashions?

That seems to be a cause of the root problem you may be facing.

That and not being able to stow the hose without swinging the bottle forward.

_R

 

[elgoog]

Is there a reason why you are clipping the two different clips in different fashions? That seems to be a cause of the root problem you may be facing.

That's a good point. Here's my thinking on it.

For me, the "correct" direction seems to be what I'm doing with the SPG snap .i.e. back to front, because it most resembles the muscle memory of what I do with the other snaps on my chest D-rings .i.e down to up. I feel for the location of the D-rings with the back of my thumb which also holds the gate down and am able to clip in pretty easily that way.

In the Rec 3 class, I was taught to have the top clip of the stage "gate down" .i.e. the opposite direction, and I think I used that same logic for the bottom snap. I guess I should still be able to feel for the D-ring in the same way but, for whatever reason, it didn't quite work the same way.

That and not being able to stow the hose without swinging the bottle forward.

I was able to do this reasonably well without unclipping in the class but the stage was pretty full at that time - from my notes, it never dropped below 1800 psi then and was still hanging relatively horizontal. It's a lot harder for me when it's significantly butt light. I actually started swinging it forward because I observed some of my local buddies do the same and able to get the hose in very easily - they are far more experienced tech and cave divers which may have had something to do with it as well.

 

[rjack321]

Don't change gear to solve a skills problem. Learn how to stow the stage reg without swinging the stage out in front of you. I guarantee learning how to stow the reg will be in invaluable skill for many years longer than a 2nd Dring is useful.

 

[elgoog]

Don't change gear to solve a skills problem.

Yep, also want to avoid this.

 

[rjack321]

What rubber bands are you using? And what gloves?

 

[elgoog]

G17K rubber pullover dry gloves with a micro fleece glove underneath. Dexterity is pretty good - actually better than the 5mm neoprene gloves I keep as backup in my kit.

I use the DGX Hogarthian Kit and the rubber bands are the simple inner tube style ones. I use 2; the upper one goes over the nylon cord, forming a little wedge I can get my finger in, and the lower one is below the hose clamp and flush with the tank. I've seen some divers use the rubber bands that has the little pull tab on it but I'm not sure how much it would help for what's described below.

My problem hasn't been getting under the rubber band (the top one, at least) but fighting the tank once it get's close to empty and super floaty. If it's still clipped in to my side, I'm basically using my left arm to wrestle it into a position my right hand can reach across to get the hose put into place. It's frustrating to say the least and I found it much easier to control the tank in front of me. Being able to see everything and getting the second stage tucked in nice and neat was also helpful.

 

[rjack321]

Why is the al80 empty? As a deco bottle at your level it shouldn't be more the 1/2 empty/full.

But even with it empty, push the tail down with your left elbow. Use your left thumb to lift the rubber band which should be near the crown of the cylinder. Insert a loop of 2nd stage hose with the right hand. Grab the loop with your left fingers (remember the thumb lifts the band). Pull the loop back.

 

[elgoog]

Why is the al80 empty? As a deco bottle at your level it shouldn't be more the 1/2 empty/full.

For a Rec3 type dive where I use it as a deco bottle, this is never an issue. The reason the empty-ish bottle manipulation and reg stowing is happening is because I'm using it as a bottom stage. Quoted the details from the first post below.

My primary diving is with a DPV from shore and I recently started diving with a stage so I could dive the farther out sites in the reserve. We use this as a bottom stage, breathing the stage down first and continuing and ending the dive on backgas. EAN32 everywhere.

But even with it empty, push the tail down with your left elbow. Use your left thumb to lift the rubber band which should be near the crown of the cylinder. Insert a loop of 2nd stage hose with the right hand. Grab the loop with your left fingers (remember the thumb lifts the band). Pull the loop back.

I think this may be causing one of the problems I'm facing. My top band is very close to the hose clamp, I'd say about half way up the tank. Maybe reaching that far back/around while also pushing down a light tank is what's causing me some trouble (??)

 

[rjack321]

Well you aren't supposed to be using a bottom stage in rec3. But try moving the top rubber band up around 1.5" / 3cm below the crown, the lower one is maybe 12" below that, perhaps 2/3rds of the way down the stage strap hose.

And use your elbow to push down the butt of the tank