• Welcome to ScubaBoard


  1. Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

    Benefits of registering include

    • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
    • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
    • You can make this box go away

    Joining is quick and easy. Login or Register now by clicking on the button

19 Dead, Hundreds Adrift in Philippines Typhoon

Discussion in 'Storm Watch' started by DandyDon, Jun 21, 2008.

  1. DandyDon

    DandyDon Old men ought to be explorers ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: One kilometer high on the Texas Central Plains
    49,496
    4,959
    113
    AFP: Philippine divers enter sunken ferry, hundreds feared dead
    [c][​IMG][/c]
     
  2. BlueReef

    BlueReef Instructor, Scuba

    53
    0
    0
    Thanks for the updates Dandy (been trying to filter through accurate reports myself - not easily I might add).

    It's been a long time for them now though! I've not had much 'experience' with ship tradgedies, but anyone know how long you can survive in a room of air, because a scuba tank has a fair amount in it but only gives you an hour or two, so can't be so much more - especially if the pressure shrunk any air pockets!

    Just read a report saying "The ship was resting upside down with the tip of its bow above water and its stern resting on the bottom of the sea, easily visible from shore." - It looks a pretty big ship, so depending on the angle could be deep water, but I'd like to know the depth there if anyone knows?

    I'm interested in rescue ops (never done it), but just trying to imagine how on earth you go about rescuing people from something like that. They were talking about cutting their way in, but which ever way you go about it, you're gonna let water into a compartment, and it's then a race of air time/ having enough air sources to give out, and pressure affecting any surviors you meet in there - unless you can seal and purge as you go?

    The coast guard usually have big ships, but even so, how difficult would a refloat be logistically? There would be a weakening in the hull of course, but don't think it should affect integrity too much as air bags would just support it.

    What qualifications would you need to be on a rescue response team? I'm no paramedic by far, neither can I weld (though welding can be learnt easily), but going in and extracting someone - I'd be up for that. As for handling the sights down there, I guess I can't answer that till the time came.
     
  3. DandyDon

    DandyDon Old men ought to be explorers ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: One kilometer high on the Texas Central Plains
    49,496
    4,959
    113
    Current 4:42am Wednesday (PHT) - Time in Philippines

    BlueReef, about the only question I might address would be that if they cut thru the hull below the water line inside, then there would not be an air escape at that cut. There are other concerns. This article paints a morbid picture...

    No survivors found in stricken Philippines ferry | World news | guardian.co.uk

    [​IMG]
    Divers on a rubber boat wait beside the capsized ferry MV Princess of the Stars, off Sibuyan island. Photograph: Romeo Ranoco/Reuters​

    Even for those who found trapped air right away, looks like too much time has passed, too little O2, possibly contaminates in the air. None of the other articles seem to have any new, good news today. Looks like a massive, sad tragedy.
     
  4. BlueReef

    BlueReef Instructor, Scuba

    53
    0
    0
    Again, my knowledge of ferries is minimal. My mind is just mostly going on documentaries of designs of warships etc, but then they are designed more for taking 'hits'. Likewise some tankers have double hulls, and the storage of fuel/cargo etc is compartmentalised into many smaller holding tanks - of course with ferries they don't so much have this issue. But if there was a rupture of a fuel tank it might leak into this cavity and pool at the lowest point. Also warship's doors can lock airtight, but I believe passenger ferries too have sections that lock off? (and I don't think this info just comes from the film Titanic!).

    Photos show the angle as not very steep indeed, so doesn't look to be that deep (but then it IS a big boat!)
    [​IMG]

    Also the following local news report maybe interesting to some HERE. From this, it does look like the ship is resting on the bottom and not actually that far off shore.

    Here's an interesting quote from one survivor (seemingly being one good thing to come out of Hollywood):-
    However, indeed, it's a great shame and I think chances are now very slim of finding survivors.
     
  5. DandyDon

    DandyDon Old men ought to be explorers ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: One kilometer high on the Texas Central Plains
    49,496
    4,959
    113
    Some recent articles...

    [​IMG]

    The Associated Press: Pesticides in sunken Philippine ferry halt search
    Divers head to sunken Philippine ferry to remove toxic cargo; retrieval of bodies halted - International Herald Tribune
    Well great. The ferry company had 11 tons of pesticide on a passenger ferry and didn't bother to tell the rescue force.

    AFP: Sunken Philippine ferry can easily be refloated: official
     
  6. BlueReef

    BlueReef Instructor, Scuba

    53
    0
    0
    Great - good to know that once again money has been put first over people's lives!! (damn lawyers)

    now then, if it had been refloated the first night/day as I suggested I wonder if there may have been more alive today? I don't know, but I hope there will be a report done to find out if any 'chambers' had significant air inside and for how long it stayed there.

    as for the fertiliser - something makes me wonder if there's actually something more important down there instead of fertiliser. If not then it looks like there another few reefs gone from our world.
     
  7. Rickg

    Rickg Manta Ray

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: San Diego, CA
    1,031
    2
    38
    This ship was 193m in length and displaced approximately 24,000 tons. Here is a link to pictures of the ship to give you an idea of the size.

    Princess of the Stars | Shipping News | New Zealand Shipping and Marine Society

    It would be impossible to refloat (do you actually mean "upright") the ship within the first day/night even if the sinking had taken place in shallow waters off the coast of the US or Great Britain. A salvage operation of this size will take a long time to plan even before they start the actual work.
     
  8. DandyDon

    DandyDon Old men ought to be explorers ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: One kilometer high on the Texas Central Plains
    49,496
    4,959
    113
    Yeah, and I would think they'd want to remove possible survivors before trying to refloat even in other conditions. I just thot it was interesting that the owners are avoiding reasonable efforts; would rather leave it there and cash the check.

    The chemical seems to be a pesticide known as endosulfan, not fertilizer. No one will claim responsibility on placing it on a passenger ferry in violation of safety regs.
     
  9. Rickg

    Rickg Manta Ray

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: San Diego, CA
    1,031
    2
    38
    Don,

    Most of the ships owned by the Sulpicio Lines are listed as passenger/cargo vessels. Not living in the Philippines I would hazard to guess whether putting the pesticide on this vessel was a violation of their safety regs. I haven't read every post and link on this subject but from what I'm aware of it isn't that unusual to for hazardous materials to included as cargo on oceangoing vessels. It was only 12 years ago that we in the US had ValuJet Flight 592 where there was a lot of hazardous material on a passenger plane. In no way am I trying to make excuses for the operator of this vessel. They should never have attempted to maintain their schedule with the weather info they had available.
     
  10. DandyDon

    DandyDon Old men ought to be explorers ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: One kilometer high on the Texas Central Plains
    49,496
    4,959
    113
    I didn't guess. That was in the first article linked on the pesticide...
    in the other one...
    Del Monte didn't receive their pesticide, ran tracing, learned from another source, then warned the government. There is additional info in other articles if you want to read some of them.
     

Share This Page