30/30 in warm water, am I sweating or do I have a leak?

[tarjan]

I purchased a new (to me) 30/30 show model earlier in the year. Looks great. The wrist seals were pre-cut for show use, as was the neck, but it was too big and DUI replaced that for me without issue. My dive shop helped me out with with cutting the neck right for me and said the wrist seals looked good without replacing so I left those as they were.

Get in the water, do my dive and I feel great in the water. When I get back my arms are wet, maybe a bit of moisture on my chest as well. Not soaking mind you, just obviously moist. Legs are bone dry.

I think this means I have a slight leak at my wrists (both arms wet), but then again it could be sweat. Maybe it is my wrists have tendons that are too proud, or maybe the seals are a bit loose since I have tiny wrists, though I am not sure? (un)fortunately I do my diving in warmer water, since I am chilled even after doing a few 82 degree dives. I cannot feel any water coming in the suit at any point though, just not enough of a temperature differential to say "hey, my arm is getting cold".

Anyone have a good way to check on shore? I tried to push the sleeves up a bit so the seals ride higher on my arms, but it just gets pushed back down because of the fabric.

I'm still new to the whole drysuit thing, so this might just be something you figure out with experience but any help would be very appreciated.

 

[Shftrdog]

A way to see if it is leaking is take some rubber bands and put them around the wrist seals. Then go on a dive, if there is no leak them it is the seals. If you are still wet then it is sweating. The rubber bands need to be snug.

 

[TSandM]

If you are diving in 82 degree water, with commensurate air temperatures, you can expect a fair amount of condensation on the inside of the suit. Whether that chills you or not will depend on how good the insulating layer you are wearing is at keeping the condensation away from your body, and that gets harder as the material gets thinner.

It is often the case that there is some seepage from wrist seals, especially if your wrists are small and your tendons are prominent, and even more if you have to use your hands for anything. It IS possible to cut seals small enough to avoid this -- I did not think this was true until Danny Riordan did it for me. If you put elastic bands around the seals and the moisture is reduced, this is one of your problems.

If you are wet on your chest, either your neck seal is leaking or your inlet valve is. Both are possible.

 

[Bubbletrubble]

There's another possibility that hasn't been mentioned yet. You could have a slightly leaky dryzipper. Replacement cost is rather expensive ($300+ to cover parts & labor), so I hope that's not it.

Did DUI pressure-test the suit after replacing the neck seal? If the suit passed a pressure-test, then you could rule out leaky zipper/inflate valve/exhaust valve/seams.

Highest on the list of possible issues: wrist seal issues and neck-seal "burping." As pointed out above, prominent wrist tendons combined with manipulating things with your hands can cause water infiltration through the wrist seals. Generally, this will cause soggy forearms, though. Inexperienced drysuit divers tend to get vertical (head-up/feet-down) in the water column which induces a squeeze on the lower extremities, forcing air to move up and escape/burp through the neck seal. During the burp, some water infiltrates the neck seal.

On an unrelated note, you didn't mention the condition of the ankle seals, but I suppose they must be in good enough shape since your legs remained dry during the dive. I also hear that DUI is now providing the option of installing Turbosoles or the Rockboot system on the 30/30 suit.

 

[knowone]

Snug elastic bands around wrists may contribute to DCS potential

 

[TSandM]

Yes, excessively tight wrist bands could increase the possibility of DCS in the hands. But a shallow test dive to see if the leakage is diminished is not going to be a big issue. I suspect the vasoconstriction from the cold when wearing wet gloves in Puget Sound is worse on the offgassing than any wrist seal one could tolerate wearing would be!

 

[tarjan]

Thanks for the responses. It will be a few months before my next dive, but will try some light rubber bands.

Does anyone have any pictures of their wrists with properly fit seals and what they look like? Do you see obvious squeezing at the edges of the rubber and skin?

Can you describe the feel? What I see is "it should be comfortable, but not too tight" which is an meaningless statement, just too subjective. What I am looking for is if I should feel pressure like a gentle even squeeze around my wrist or should it be lighter so I can barely feel anything other than the weight of it. That is a bit more descriptive, but I would bet someone with more experience could tell me more.

My wrist is ~6.25" in circumference and when I flex my hand down the largest tendon stands out about 1/2", maybe a touch more. I have very little fat on my wrists, so no "squish" area.

The burping is a possibility though. I did get rid of as much air as possible before jumping in each time (standard squeeze into a ball thing), and know that when I put my arms up towards the surface, any air would always bleed out, though I tried to keep the air in the suit to an absolute minimum. Maybe that is my whole problem I guess, just need to keep my arms where they should be, on my camera, showing me my wrist computer or at my stomach.

Legs are dry and the suit was pressure tested before being sent to me, so it shouldn't be valves or zipper.

 

[Lumin]

Im diving with a tls 350 in warm water so not exactly 30/30.

I usually feel the water coming in if I have a tendon leak, I try to minimize that as much as possible by relaxing the hands, even while doing tasks such as dpv riding or photography. But I guess depending on undergarment position you might not notice.

Regarding the seals, you should feel it around your wrist with a light pressure and your skin fat should form a small bump where the seal stops; to ensure proper sealing your hands should start to tingle after prolonged wear like 2-3 hrs. It's not an ideal situation though, if you wear gloves 5mm or seal to seal dry gloves you might get away with having looser seals as the gloves will help pushing the seal onto your skin.

If you have cone shaped seals you might want to change to bottle neck seals if you have very protruding tendons. the bottle neck will give you more sealing surface than the cone shape ones.

 

[FOrtins]

I tend to agree the group that it is most likely tendon issues that are causing this. I just used my 3030 in the Phillipines and had the same thing happen. Diving from a small boat where you need to hand up your gear while holding onto the rope will definitely make the tendons flex! I also wasn't wearing any gloves so that also will make the wrist seals leak more if there is any flexing going on. We sometimes use a 1" wide soft neoprene band over a neck seal to keep it leaking when someone with a slender neck (and usually prominent tendons) moves their head. We could send you a sample and you could try it on the neck. We have never made one for the wrists before, but it should work. You would just need to make it smaller. Please let me know if that is what you would like to try.

Faith Ortins

 

[TSandM]

For me, for the wrist seals to be watertight, they are uncomfortable on land. There is a definite indentation of the skin where the seal edge sits. The veins on the hand are more prominent after donning the seal, but the hand color doesn't change.

If the seals are snug and elastic feeling, like a snug turtleneck, they will leak.

If they sit flat and feel "light pressure" my arms will be soaked above the elbows by the end of the dive.

It's the same with a neck seal. If it's a little uncomfortable on land, so that I keep wanting to reach up and pull it off my neck, it will be dry. If it's easy to get on and doesn't feel annoying, it's likely to leak.