Jacket vs back inflate for new diver?

[rx7diver]

My eldest daughter, a university sophomore, is taking a university scuba course this semester. The course uses Scubapro "Classic" BC's. They are a solid BC. I, myself, did my open water training using one. (Actually, about 35 years ago I took the same course she is taking now. Her mother took the same course a couple of semesters before me.)

Our first BC's (mine and her mother's) were newer versions, ~1987 versions, of the BC's we had used in class. A couple of months ago, my daughter dug her mother's long-unused, dusty BC out of her mother's basement and tried it on. (See attached pic.)

I imagine that my daughter's first dives after certification will have her in a (probably rented) Scubapro Classic BC and me in my "new" (~1993) Scubapro Black Classic BC, which I still love to dive occasionally. At some point, I expect she will want to try my SS Freedom Plate and Halcyon single-tank wings--especially since this is the configuration she sees me wear most often, and much of her scuba course involves skills completed in an old-style plastic back pack with a single tank (but no BC), and she has dove (backyard pool) in my VDH double-hose back plate and DH reg (but no BC).

I hope that by the time my daughter is ready to own her own gear, she will have had the opportunity to sample several gear configurations--including several types of BC. Then she can make an informed choice.

FWIW.

rx7diver

 

[johndiver999]

Thanks, and what would you recommend for back inflate BCs that are a good value for middle of the road gear?

The arguments will go round and round on here. HOWEVER, if you are considering a back inflate BC (which has some advantages and disadvantages) AND you are price conscious, then you REALLY need to do some research on the BP/W option. I think you could buy a decent BP/W (with the aluminum plate) and whatever type of harness you want, for a good bit less than most back inflate BC's.

I won't even recommend one over the other ( back inflate over BP?W) but you need to do some homework - again assuming that you are sure that you want all the buoyancy behind you.

 

[MichaelMc]

Just to note that many here recommend BP/W systems because they like them, even for recreational diving. I'm not sure it is peer *preasure* as much as peer recommendation based on experience.

Clearly many in the wider recreational dive world do not dive them. The 'oh no, looks tech' may account for that (but you can get them in cool colors), and the general lack of them in dive shops. Most of the general dive population may also not have as much experience as the people here generally do, nor spend as much time thinking carefully about their gear.

Anyway, it is a recommendation, not like we'll sit beside you on the boat and bug you til you switch. Assuming 'which BC do you recommend?' is not the current conversation topic.

 

[thomasj1107]

Just to note that many here recommend BP/W systems because they like them, even for recreational diving. I'm not sure it is peer *preasure* as much as peer recommendation based on experience.

Clearly many in the wider recreational dive world do not dive them. The 'oh no, looks tech' may account for that (but you can get them in cool colors), and the general lack of them in dive shops. Most of the general dive population may also not have as much experience as the people here generally do, nor spend as much time thinking carefully about their gear.

Anyway, it is a recommendation, not like we'll sit beside you on the boat and bug you til you switch, if 'which BC do you recommend?' is not the current conversation topic.

If I do decide I definitely want the inflation behind me, what does the BP/W offer or lack compared to a regular back inflate BC?

 

[Shabaday]

My friend in Stuart Fl loves his Zeagle BC...there are many different styles of Zeagle BC...I started with a Zeagle and I still have a Zeagle Covert XT but I prefer BP/W set up for me
Buoyancy Compensators Archives - Zeagle

 

[MichaelMc]

If I do decide I definitely want the inflation behind me, what does the BP/W offer or lack compared to a regular back inflate BC?

There have been many threads on this. Here are some quotes of my replies in some of them on why BP/W:

Jacket BC is a motorcycle with the engine, wheels and suspension choice locked in place (sewn together), as well as the size and style of panniers. And many of them, for 'ease', put the handlebars (weight pockets) too far out front (down low), where it is harder to get comfortable (trimmed out for easy movement) on the road (in the water).

BP/W is a cycle frame (the BP/W concept) that takes modular engines, wheels, and suspension from, say, 20 (mostly) mutually compatible manufacturers and has built-in rails (2" webbing and the plate itself) for attaching your choice of panniers or other accessories not just in one spot but throughout the bike. Plus, most of the manufacturers sell a full up built one so you need not build or customize from parts if you do not want to. And the handlebars (weight distribution) are typically set up for you already in a much smoother (trimmed out) way, so it is easier as you start out.

But, you know, you could go either way.

To be clear, I was not suggesting that a BP/W with a specific wing and plate is flexible to all dive situations. But if you wanted to change one part of a BP/W, you can do that without searching and hoping someone makes a complete BC with all the things you liked about your current BC but with the one change you wanted to make. Understanding that the wing is a big part/component that is expensive and likely impractical to customize internally once you’ve picked it, you would need to buy a new wing.

(Thou some small doubles wings may be serviceable but not near optimal for both singles and modest doubles, e.g., DivRite Rec wing, though not really recommended for singles. And when I was researching small doubles, some singles wings were recommended as compatible, some of the less tailored ones in shape. So one wing can cover a wide range.)

The easy and more frequent use of flexibility is what you put where on it. Particularly trim weights can be put on any of the straps or even the plate top edge. That is not as easy, in a clean and tidy manner, with most sewn together BCs that I have seen.
ETA: The buddy commando does not look any different from other sewn together BCs in this respect.

Many here like BP/Ws for recreational or technical diving. There are many brands. Mostly all parts are interchangeable between brands. PB/W are easy to trim out (they put weight over your buoyant lungs and provide many locations for attaching lead via straps or zip-tied to the plate), very adjustable, and easy to grow with moderate size children. Women and shorter children may benefit from a shorter plate, several shorter women here claimed it was a game changer. You can go with one continuous loop of webbing for uber-uber reliability or adjustable buckles or shoulder disconnects depending on your preference. Quick starting points are:
DGX Custom - DGX Gears Singles Harness / Backplate / Wing Package
Beginners Guide To BP/W
Deep6: Buoyancy

Clicking on the arrows at the start of the quotes will take you to those threads.

You can get a fully set up basic BP/W from an online (or supporting local) shop as easily as you can get any other back inflate BC. And it will be more durable, more adjustable to your needs and start you with a better weight distribution than the alternatives.

(And an 'advanced' BP/W is just a basic one whose configuration you've refined over time to better fit your needs, if you felt any such changes were needed.)

 

[Bigbella]

I had always hated the jackets from day-one -- too claustrophobic for my tastes -- and originally started with a heavy nylon(?) backplate, with stiff, easy to replace straps, to which a horseshoe-shaped bladder could be attached; that, along with a conventional weight belt -- had that set-up for years.

I wound up with Zeagle back-inflating BCs, starting in the early nineties, since most every component could simply be replaced, if damaged, free of charge at the time, as opposed to the ScubaPro jackets -- and never looked back; and truly got to appreciate weight-integrated BCs.

I now limit weight belts to free-diving; but ultimately, choices will be determined by your personal tastes . . .

 

[formernuke]

Try a back inflate, try a bpw, then get the style your most comfortable in.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

For value, it is REALLY hard to beat this offering from DGX for $400: DGX Custom - DGX Gears Singles Harness / Backplate / Wing Package

I don't get the rational for paying around 2x as much (or more) for any BCD system. Save that money for dive trips!

 

[thomasj1107]

For value, it is REALLY hard to beat this offering from DGX for $400: DGX Custom - DGX Gears Singles Harness / Backplate / Wing Package

I don't get the rational for paying around 2x as much (or more) for any BCD system. Save that money for dive trips!

For people who are against BP/W vs regular back inflate bcd, what exactly are the complaints? What are the cons of the BP/w?