Long-hose in the time of COVID-19

[kensuf]

The OOG diver gets a working regulator. What about the donor?

The donor is in control of the situation and has a little bit of time. The primary concern is to get gas to the diver that needs it NOW. If your backup isn't working, you have a moment or two to sort it out with the guy that had been out of gas. If you *REALLY* need an alternate backup to your backup to grab a breath, you can always take a hit off your power inflator (this is a scenario for having a really ****** day).

 

[Angelo Farina]

The donor is in control of the situation and has a little bit of time. The primary concern is to get gas to the diver that needs it NOW. If your backup isn't working, you have a moment or two to sort it out with the guy that had been out of gas. If you *REALLY* need an alternate backup to your backup to grab a breath, you can always take a hit off your power inflator (this is a scenario for having a really ****** day).

I am well aware of this theory, but it is not generally accepted everywhere. For example, when I was trained as a firefighter, our training was exactly the opposite. It is not a problem if the guy or girl needing help stays in a dangerous situation. The firefighter should avoid doing anything posing HIM in any risk, although he should usually be much more in control of the situation.
For a firefighter it is absolutely forbidden to remove his own breathing device for helping someone in distress. It is a matter of priority: you are the one in charge of maintaining full control, better to have a firefighter alive and the victim dead, than having both dead.
We were trained thinking that all victims are "deads walking". For us, they are already dead. You try saving them, but the starting point is that they are dead, and you are alive. From this starting point, your action can perhaps improve the end result, but in no way you should allow the situation going worst (with some firefighter injured or dead).
Of course, when diving with a friend or your lady, sentiments play a role, and it starts becoming acceptable, or even preferable, to die together, instead of surviving to your loved one. I do not discuss this point, as often I dive with my wife.
Simply please accept that there can be different perspectives and different training, and that no one is "always "right", nor another "always wrong".

 

[kensuf]

If taking a regulator out of your mouth poses a risk to you then perhaps you shouldn't be diving. Regulator recovery is one of the most basic skills out there.

 

[Angelo Farina]

If taking a regulator out of your mouth poses a risk to you then perhaps you shouldn't be diving. Regulator recovery is one of the most basic skills out there.

The problem is not taking the regulator out of your mouse, the problem is giving it to a panicked buddy who is OOA. It will be very, very difficult to get it back...
You probably never had to do with someone really in panic. It happened to me several times, luckily not underwater. Just coming closer than 1.5m starts to be really dangerous, as a panicked guy can physically attack you with an incredible force.
The rule, as firefighter, was to approach from behind and immobilize him/her entirely, before trying to help. Again, the first rule was to make sure that YOU are safe, and then, perhaps, if possible, help who is in danger...

 

[PfcAJ]

The problem is not taking the regulator out of your mouse, the problem is giving it to a panicked buddy who is OOA. It will be very, very difficult to get it back...
You probably never had to do with someone really in panic. It happened to me several times, luckily not underwater. Just coming closer than 1.5m starts to be really dangerous, as a panicked guy can physically attack you with an incredible force.
The rule, as firefighter, was to approach from behind and immobilize him/her entirely, before trying to help. Again, the first rule was to make sure that YOU are safe, and then, perhaps, if possible, help who is in danger...

If you have a bungeed backup you don’t need to get it back.
They can have my primary, I don’t care. My
backup is right by my face. Solid “meh” if I lose my primary.

 

[Storker]

Risk analysis, guys. Risk analysis.

If I were OOG, I'd happily accept a primary donate from my buddy and worry about the Covid risk later. The risk of catching CoV from a healthy buddy's reg and being one of those who got serious problems from that is significantly lower than the risk of drowning if you need gas and can't get it. Notwithstanding the probability of needing gas donate in the first place.

 

[Angelo Farina]

If you have a bungeed backup you don’t need to get it back.
They can have my primary, I don’t care. My
backup is right by my face. Solid “meh” if I lose my primary.

The risk, for the donor, is that, for any reason, the backup fails. If the buddy is my wife, I happily accept that risk.
If the buddy is an unknown, then I will FIRST get the backup in my mouth, test it for 2-3 breaths, and having verified that it is in good shape and I am not at risk, then, and only then, I will cautiously offer my primary to the buddy OOA. If during this additional time he is drown, I still have done the proper safe procedure, it is not my fault.
It is donating FIRST and searching for backup LATER which is questionable, and entirely unacceptable in a firefighter perspective.

 

[tursiops]

The problem is not taking the regulator out of your mouse, the problem is giving it to a panicked buddy who is OOA. It will be very, very difficult to get it back...

But you don't need it back. You have an alternate. Does the firefighter have an alternate?

 

[tursiops]

The risk, for the donor, is that, for any reason, the backup fails. If the buddy is my wife, I happily accept that risk.
If the buddy is an unknown, then I will FIRST get the backup in my mouth, test it for 2-3 breaths, and having verified that it is in good shape and I am not at risk, then, and only then, I will cautiously offer my primary to the buddy OOA. If during this additional time he is drown, I still have done the proper safe procedure, it is not my fault.
It is donating FIRST and searching for backup LATER which is questionable, and entirely unacceptable in a firefighter perspective.

The whole firefighter thing strikes me as a very poor analogy. The OOG diver is not "already dead" and it is a different game. it is like applying the rules of Rugby to Soccer because you learned Rugby first.

 

[Jcp2]

Shouldn't both regulators should be checked and working at the beginning of the dive? If that's done properly, then the thought process that the OOG diver gets the donor primary because it works really, and the secondary might not doesn't really apply, as they both should be working. There may be other reasons to donate a primary (long hose allows distance flexibility after donation better than a short hose is one guess of mine). I'm assuming recreational single tank OW diving within NDL times.