Preventing mask loss vs a spare

[DA Aquamaster]

How do you protect the spare mask from damage? I have crushed a lot of delicate bits in pockets.

Since switching to side mount about 5 years ago, I've worn a helmet, and in addition to protecting my head and holding back up lights, it does a darn fine job of preventing mask loss.

However despite the very low probability of losing a mask breakage is always a possibility, and I'm with James on this one - exiting 2-3K feet on a scooter dive with no mask wouldn't be pretty. Even if you just broke a strap, using one hand to exit with a scooter, and using 1 hand to hold the mask in place, leaves you one hand short to do every thing else. Would it be do-able? Absolutely. But it's a PITA that would be incredibly easy to prevent by just having a back up mask in a pocket.

I don't worry about breaking the spare. I carried a Scubapro Frameless mask in my left thigh pocket for about 5 years, and for the last 5 years or so I've carried a Scubapro Orbit frameless mask. Both of those frameless designs are low volume masks that are also very compressible in the pocket, taking up very little space.

About the only thing you'd break on a frameless mask would be the one piece tempered glass lens. That's not likely to ever happen, but to add a little more security, I carry the lens side of the mask against my leg. Any object that impacts the mask would have to get past the pocket material, the semi-folded mask skirt, and the neoprene slap strap inside the mask with enough force left to break the glass.

In 10 years, of basically abusing and ignoring it in the pocket, I've never broken or even scratched one.

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Someone, back when this wasn't a Zombie thread commented on putting the mask strap under the hood. That works to retain the mask, even if the strap breaks. However in very cold water it gives the water a straight shot to your ears, and that can range from less than pleasant, to cold, to vertigo inducing. I didn't do that more than once or twice in cold water.

Since switching to side mount about 5 years ago, I've worn a helmet, and in addition to protecting my head and holding back up lights, it does a darn fine job of preventing any potential for mask loss.

 

[ScubaMarc]

I had a dive where during the entire dive i was removing a lot of excess water from my mask. I was thinking i did not shave or the hood was getting caught. When I finished the dive and coming up the ladder, one lens fell out. Water was holding the lens in for the entire dive. If I had a spare mask, i might have swapped out the mask.

Funny: after the dive i told my dive buddy my mask was leaking on the entire dive. He said I should have asked him for his spare.

Losing a mask is not the only reason for a spare.

 

[DevonDiver]

I've never lost a mask on a dive. The biggest issue, for me, is strap failure...I've seen plenty of those. It's easily resolved by switching to a velcro/neoprene strap (why don't manufacturers just supply these as standard nowadays??).

Once you've put on a velcro/neoprene strap, the only concern is if the mask seal fails, or if the strap retainer assembly fails. I've seen a few assembly failures.... pick a mask where it can be removed in-toto and thread the velcro directly through the hole in the mask.

I had a strap retainer assembly fail once in-water. I fixed the problem en-situ with a zip-tie to connect the velcro strap directly to the mask. Quick and easy. I always carry zip-ties.

For mask seal failures...very rare it'd happen without warning....inspect your kit regularly and replace in anticipation of failure when it's looking ropey... A seal failure is unlikely to flood the entire mask, especially if you can angle your head. There should be enough of an air pocket available to read gauges when necessary. If some water in your mask seems daunting, reconsider technical diving as a hobby.

For overhead environments - well, you have a guideline, right?

And a decent tech team should be practiced and familiar with bringing up an incapacitated diver (for whatever reason), so a maskless diver should be no great dramas.

I don't carry a spare mask as routine personal kit, but may include one as a team resource on occasion.

 

[boulderjohn]

Even if you just broke a strap, using one hand to exit with a scooter, and using 1 hand to hold the mask in place, leaves you one hand short to do every thing else. .

The only time I lost a mask strap was when I was on the surface dealing with equipment issues while preparing to set up a platform. The mask got whacked and broke the attachment piece. I was a long way from shore and my replacement mask, and I did not have a lot of time, so I did the 30 minute setup dive with no mask strap. I don't think I touched the mask with my hand more than a time or two--if that. Whenever I felt the mask coming loose, I just sniffed in to recreate the seal.

Once when I was instructing a class in a pool, I realized that my neoprene mask strap had slid off and was sitting on top of my head. I put it back on. Later on the surface, we talked about it, and the students told me that they thought I had done it on purpose as some sort of a demonstration. They said it had been loose for about 15 minutes before I realized it.

Scootering would no doubt be a different story because of the higher speed, which could blow a mask off. It would be an interesting experiment to see how fast you can go without losing a strapless mask.

 

[Nemrod]

I was having dinner with several old diving mates and the subject of carrying a spare mask came up. The group has a lot of experience diving in harsh conditions all over the world — military, commercial, and open-sea Scuba. The “young guy” has only been diving 27 years. After some bantering, it turns out that none of us has ever lost a mask. Knee-jerk conclusion: No reason to carry a spare.

A few glasses of wine later and the sea-stories started surfacing where losing a mask would have been a big problem and what care was exercised to avoid it. The most common method was to pull the hood down, put the mask on, and pull the hood over the strap. Others just tied a piece of line to the mask and hooked it on somewhere. Naturally, duct tape was employed more than once. None of us bothered with these measures on normal dives, but are highly conditioned to protect our mask. More accurate conclusion:
A) Do what is necessary not to lose your mask.
B) Not losing your mask is a better solution than resorting to a spare, which can also be lost and takes time to deal with.

I was reviewing this conversation the other night and this thought progression evolved:

1. Losing a mask is never desirable ranging from embarrassing, expensive, blowing the dive, to possibly contributing to a dangerous situation.
2. Wearing the mask strap under the hood is a reliable means of loss prevention. Unfortunately it is less comfortable, harder to adjust, more trouble to don and doff, and pulls hair out.
3. Using line and a snap-hook adds complexity and an entanglement potential, besides looking like a granny with a string around her glasses.
4. Duct tape… I won’t even go there

OK, securing the mask would be a good thing if it were fast, convenient, and didn’t compromise how we are accustomed to using it. It has to allow pulling the mask down below the jaw, and yes, putting the mask on the forehead Mike Nelson style. It also has to work with the vast majority, if not all, of the masks on the market.

Before I reinvent the wheel and make the requisite prototype errors, has anyone developed a solution? I am thinking of a strip of thin wetsuit material sewn to the back of the hood about crown-level and secured to the bottom with (ugh) Velcro.

You answered your question in your first paragraph. Generally, loosing a mask is not a problem (this is not the tech section) and neither have I ever lost a mask that I can recall. Therefore on my scale of likely events, and considering that even for solo (no deco, again we are not in the tech section), it is a non event. I do not carry a spare nor will I take any precautions not to loose my mask by creating solutions to a problem that does not really exist for a piece of equipment I can do well without.

N

 

[CuzzA]

The thing is there are activities where a lost mask has a greater probability regardless of technical diving or not. I'm sure most dives in benign conditions have an extremely low chance of losing a mask; however, take an activity like spearfishing and that changes the risk substantially.

Here's a few articles I quickly found doing a search. You can find many more if you search for them. In fact, you'll find some other boards where divers have reported losing their mask multiple times and some include a GoPro attached to them.

My First Wahoo Spearfishing (and a Brush with Death) - The Nomad Trip

Lessons for Life: Wounded Grouper Strikes Back, Fatally | Scuba Diving

A Fish Story:Hammerhead Shark Encounter at Tortuga Island

 

[Akimbo]

You answered your question in your first paragraph. Generally, loosing a mask is not a problem (this is not the tech section) and neither have I ever lost a mask that I can recall...

If you read my opening post again you will see that a small and relatively rare problem does exist that most experienced divers have learned to deal with, largely subconsciously. The solution that is “pushed” in most solo and tech training is to carry a spare mask, which began the discussion. My conclusion at that time was preventing mask loss made more sense than carrying a backup mask that could also be lost.

In the end, my experiments have yielded what turns out to be a very convenient aid to donning and doffing gear, which secondarily makes losing the mask highly unlikely. See Post 33, Update: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ad...reventing-mask-loss-vs-spare.html#post6934098

I agree with others that this solution does not prevent the destruction of a mask, which is many times less probable that losing the mask… in my experience. However, I do choose masks for durability/ruggedness in addition to fit. Many of the hyper-low volume masks on the market are, IMHO, appropriate for freediving but entirely too delicate for Scuba — especially in demanding conditions.

 

[SillyQuestions]

I dive exclusively in caves nowadays. Always solo.

I wear a helmet. Can only lose the mask if the strap breaks.

I use a fabric strap


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[Eric Sedletzky]

I know a guy who did a tech dive years ago in Monterey.
They were on their deco and this guy started to get a chronically flooding mask at his upper stops (the longest). What happened was he placed the strap on his primary mask under his hood figuring it would be a good way prevent mask loss. Well, the strap had rode up on top of his head reducing pressure on the top seal of his mask making it flood constantly. He feared an ice cream headache that could lead to bigger problems, and the water was really cold like down in the mid 40's so he didn't want to have to unzip the back of his hood, pull it down, and readjust his mask strap, or pull the mask off and put the hood back on and then replace the mask strap over the hood. He decided to just ride it out with a flooding mask. His buddy was right with him and saw the problem and kept an eye on him the whole time. After a while the flooding became so profuse that he gave up and did all his 30 (or whatever) minutes of deco with a completely flooded mask. The spare mask in his pocket did him absolutely no good in that case. I still question his skill level in that situation. It seems to me that a tech diver should be ready to do whatever is needed to rectify such a situation, but I wasn't there so what do I know.

So hearing this I decided for myself that putting a mask strap under the hood may not be such a slick idea after all.
BTW, I've never lost a mask. I've had one dislodged by a fin a couple times by students but never a complete loosing of a mask.
I always make sure the strap and skirt are in good shape, and never had a problem.

 

[Storker]

He feared an ice cream headache that could lead to bigger problems, and the water was really cold like down in the mid 40's so he didn't want to have to unzip the back of his hood, pull it down, and readjust his mask strap, or pull the mask off and put the hood back on and then replace the mask strap over the hood.

Huh?

I've seen quite a few hoods in my time (and I have three myself), but none at all with a zipper at the back. It seems as a pretty lousy idea if the point of wearing a hood is to keep your head warm.