Would you dive if you flew out within 24 hours?

[Christi]

Here is that "American" lack of personal responsibility coming through - expecting others to think and make decisions for you (generally speaking) as a "trained" diver!!! This drives me insane - and my former career was in the legal field for a plaintiff's firm! Hahah!

What liability is there if we are following DAN's (the leading authority in dive medicine) guidelines?

Aside from that, are you now saying that dive ops should also be babysitters and nanny's? I do in fact get flight info from my divers for this reason and others, but I cannot really keep them out of the water if that's what they want. I advise and remind my divers of the DAN recommendations and give them my opinion based on how much diving they have done during the week, profiles, etc. - but it is ultimately their decision. However, if they are within the 12 hours, I will refuse them service - but again, that rarely happens here due to flight schedules from Cozumel.

you are absolutely correct. and you actually made my point for me. i do not have enough scientific understanding of nitrogen loading and off gassing. it is all "theory". everyone is different. even christi said she got bent 2 times and she did nothing "wrong". so yes, i will follow what i was taught to do. if that means i "fell for it hook line and sinker", then so be it. i have never had a problem scheduling my dives to give me 24hrs before leaving. and until i have the knowledge and experience that will allow me to make a different choice, i will stick to 24hrs.

---------- Post added January 20th, 2013 at 05:28 PM ----------



i apologize for my typing mistakes. i will try harder next time.

as far as the quote i posted......i was only trying to add relevant info to the discussion (which i am finding very interesting btw). that statement is a direct quote from the SSI "science of diving" manual.

i am not saying it is right or wrong. that is beyond me to make a judgement like that. it simply is what it is.

---------- Post added January 20th, 2013 at 05:33 PM ----------



no offense was intended towards anyone who is a cave diver. i was only trying to make a point about following your own training and not relying on someone else to make that decision for you. sorry if anyone took it the wrong way.


btw......there may be another reason i believe dive ops (at least all of the ones i have ever used) suggest a 24hr wait. would it not make sense that a dive op would rather advise its customers to wait the 24hrs rather than telling them it is ok to only wait 12 or 18 (depending on the circumstances). is there not a possible liability issue here. if some rookie diver comes down to mexico for a week of diving for example, is it not prudent to recommend a longer wait time rather than the "minimum" wait time.
as someone who is hoping to be a dive con at some point in the future, i know i would feel much better knowing my student or my stores customer was taking the best precautions, and not just doing the "minimum".
but seeing as i am not a dive pro, maybe i am way off on this one ?? many here would have a better perspective on this than i would.

 

[rick00001967]

christi......i'm on your side. i think every time we turn around there is someone blaming someone else for their mistakes and they expect them to pay for it. but this is the world we live in like it or not. that is why i posed the question. is this not a possible liability for someone in your position ??
diver dives - diver waits 12 hrs minimum on your recommendation - diver fly's - diver gets bent - diver sues you.......christi said i would be fine if i waited 12hrs.

i agree it is not your fault. but do shops not worry about this type of thing. i know i would be. so i personally would think it would be better to recommend something other than the "minimum"

btw.....i'm a canadian. lol we have the same problem up here though.

 

[Christi]

AS I said - if we are following DAN's guidelines - what liability is there??? They are not MY guidelines, they are DAN's!

And not to sound too arrogant or that I am dismissing someone getting bent, but good luck to a diver that wants to sue because they got bent - especially trying to sue a dive shop in Mexico for that! I don't know of any cases where a dive shop has been held liable for someone getting bent. It just wouldn't hold up in court unless the dive shop did something very egregious - stating DAN's guidelines and recommendations is FAR from that!!

 

[rick00001967]

question posed - question answered - thx

 

[Tigerman]

christi......i'm on your side. i think every time we turn around there is someone blaming someone else for their mistakes and they expect them to pay for it. but this is the world we live in like it or not.
...

Um, no.. thats the america people live in. Might be the same in canada, I dont know, but trying to sue somoene around here for doing something stupid would get you absolutely nowhere - probably not even into the courtroom in the first place..

 

[diver 85]

yes, do it all the time.......

 

[Steve_C]

Steve, we're not talking about dive tables here. We're talking about DAN airborne-ascent-to-altitude recommendations which were derived from clinical studies. These recommendations are relatively recent. They are not historical guidelines based on fit young sailors. We're talking about recommendations made barely ten years ago with recreational divers in mind. Furthermore, the cabin pressurization used in the studies was the minimum stipulated by FAA regulations--8000 feet--so that the recommendations would be conservative.

That's not how probability works. Each time it's the same theoretical 1% chance. Relative frequency is the number of incidents actually recorded over a number of trials, so if a diver did two dives only and was bent on one of them, his relative frequency for getting bent would be 50%. Based on the statistical evidence in the clinical trials, we can say that the more dives a diver does with no bends, the closer he will progressively get to the the expected 1% probability if he ever does get a bend. I've done thousands of dives and have never been bent. So if I ever do take a hit, my relative frequency will be well below 1%.

Ah. My statement was based on the assumption that the probability of was per diver per dive. You are saying that it is 0.1 per diver. And that is averaged over all divers of all experiences. So the actual rate per diver per dive is an unknown number for this discussion but is obviously much less than per diver. Thanks for the clarification.