BC purchase advice for future expansion

[1982shawn]

Ok so im new to SCUBA. I am starting to buy all my gear ive already got exposure suits and now i am looking into a BC system that i can expand later for future endeavours, id like to get into wreck and cave diving. Im looking at buying a SS BP with "comfort straps", bands for my current single tank usage, and a wing which is where my question come in.

Im a big guy 6'6 300lbs, i plan to invest in a dual tank setup sometime within the next year, but for now will be using just a single tank setup. Im pretty sure from what ive read that changing a BP froma single to doubles is rather easy?

Next the wing i am looking at has 94lbs lift its the OMS Single Bladder BCs with retraction bands, will i be ok buying this now and using it until my training advances do doubles and a dry suit? I really dont want to have to buy a small wing now and then in a year or 2 have to sell it and buy a bigger one.

The total setup was about 580$, within my budget for a BC system. Any and all sugestions and advice is greatly appreciated.

 

[chrpai]

No, you will need a singles wing and a doubles wing. Neither of them should be 94lbs of lift!

I suggest you find a mentor who dives locally with a BP/W to give you an intro to your best options. You can buy a BP/W now for say $350 and worry about doubles later. You'll probably find yourself having a singles rig and a doubles rig and adding in the cost of the second doubles rig is not much more money then you'd thought you'd spend in the first place only you'll have two rigs each optimized for it's purpose.

If you want to save a few bucks then you spend a couple hundred for a good quality doubles wing and switch out your singles wing. That puts you under what you thought you'd spend.

The real cost will come from the 2 more tanks you'll want, tank bands, isolation manifold, regulator, dry suit and so on.

In other words, start with a low cost singles rig and get real good at diving that before worrying about doubles.

 

[decompression]

It's great your thinking of the future and a back plate/wing is a great way to start. If I can save you some grief and money from my experience it may help. The set up you describe is certainly functional but you may find its not really recommended by your future instructor. Many in the tech and cave community follow the hogarthian way of diving, in which a simple one piece harness will suffice. A 94# wing works great for 130 doubles and 4 stage bottles but not so good for much less. I think that type of diving might be a bit down the road yet. When choosing a wing you must first establish a balanced rig as well as consider current/near future diving. I think you'll find 94# is a bit over kill for most diving. Read up on hogarthian, DIR, balanced rig and you'll get some insight. It's very easy with a single tank adapter to switch from singles to doubles but you will need 2 wings, I'm sure you'll read why. A big recommendation is to do an intro to tech course, this will give you valuable insight to different rig set ups and skills. Many shops/manufactuers offer similar rigs and I think many would agree that considering your location (and hopes theres a drysuit involved in your plans) that a good multipurpose set up is a SS backplate/40-50#wing/one piece harness/2 steel HP100 tanks. Some places to look are Deep Sea Supply, HOG, UTD, Divegearexpress and many others. Before you spend any cash at least pick up a intro to tech student manual and give it a good read through, keep asking questions and best of luck!

 

[1982shawn]

Decompression thanks for the insight. I only assumed 95# would be a good number because when i have all my gear on i weigh in at over 400#'s adn i assumed 25% of that would be a good figure. I will definitely be reading up on the topics you suggested. What does DIR stand for? Sadly i cant do the intro to tech course until i have finished advanced open water, which will hopefully be at the end of the month. I will be buying a drysuit ASAP, though it will probably have to be custom made. What amount of lift would be suitable for single tank diving?

---------- Post Merged at 09:11 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 09:09 PM ----------

chrpai, thanks for the advice. Any suggestion on a single rig?

 

[00wabbit]

I am looking at getting the Hollis SMS 100. You can dive sidemount doubles or a single backmount tank.

If you haven't read about sidemount you should. You don't have to carry all that weight on your back an you will have 2 completely seperate air sources.

 

[decompression]

Ah yes.....DIR.......Doing it right......a somewhat controversial thing years ago but less now. It's an amalgamation of procedures, equipment and standardization taken from the best practices of overhead (cave) diving, to be brief. A lot of it is common practice now, I'm certified by four different agencies and each involve some of these elements. If you are diving dry (optimal for a lot of reasons), dependent on tank type and size, a good cold water wing should have around 30 lbs for a single tank. Have a look at whites fusion drysuits, big fit without custom prices (I'm 6'3", 290). There are a couple of systems that can do sidemount and back mount, I have the Alpha/Delta wing by Unified Team Diving which does this, very handy indeed. Especially if you can't afford multiple set ups. Many will say one wing cant do two things, but have they ever dove it? I have and it does. The nice thing about this board is there is such a wide spectrum of experience and opinions, so you should get lots of info, just remember that no matter what.....I'm always right.lol.

 

[TSandM]

1982shawn, do I read you correctly, that you are not yet OW certified?

Start small. Buy a single tank setup. If you want to start with a backplate and wing, I'm all for it, since I think that's great gear. Get a long pattern plate from one of the manufacturers who offers sizes (look at Deep Sea Supply, for example) and use a simple harness. Get a wing that works for a single tank -- you may need a bit bigger wing even for that than someone else, simply because your exposure protection is going to be VERY floaty! Do a bunch of single tank diving. Work on your basic skills -- learn buoyancy control, trim, positioning and situational awareness.

Tech or cave diving is a ways off -- you don't really know yet if you are even going to enjoy diving, or how much of it you will be able to do. If you want to buy gear, buy gear that works for beginners, and expand your collection as your addiction grows. At the moment, you simply don't know enough to make good equipment decisions, but you will learn.

 

[bergersau]

1982shawn, A wing only needs to have enough lift to keep the rig on the surface if you take it off in the water OR enough to offset the loss of buoyancy you'll experience as your wetsuit is compressed at depth plus the weight of the air inside your tank/s.
You should be essentially be neutral or need almost no air in the wing at safety stop depth with a nearly empty tank at the end of your dive.
At the start of the dive you'll be a 3-4 pounds heavier and will need a small amount of air in the wing to stay on the surface, maybe 5-10lbs should be enough in a single tank rig in calm water. DON'T buy a 94 pound wing, 30-40 pound should be enough.
For reference I have a dive rite voyager wing and dive a HP 110cf steel tank in a 7mm semidry wetsuit and that's plenty of lift for me even with a 40cf Stage cylinder added.

 

[halocline]

Ok so im new to SCUBA. I am starting to buy all my gear ive already got exposure suits and now i am looking into a BC system that i can expand later for future endeavours, id like to get into wreck and cave diving. Im looking at buying a SS BP with "comfort straps", bands for my current single tank usage, and a wing which is where my question come in.

Im a big guy 6'6 300lbs, i plan to invest in a dual tank setup sometime within the next year, but for now will be using just a single tank setup. Im pretty sure from what ive read that changing a BP froma single to doubles is rather easy?
Next the wing i am looking at has 94lbs lift its the OMS Single Bladder BCs with retraction bands, will i be ok....

I had to have a little chuckle about this. A 94 lb wing is basically insane, and a good example of why I would never suggest to anyone to buy an OMS product. They seem to find a way to do something wrong no matter what.....and their customer service is legendarily bad.

That said, congrats on starting scuba and thinking ahead with your gear purchase. Your size doesn't affect your lift needs directly, although there is an indirect relationship, because bigger people often need more weight and wear larger suits that, consequently to their size, lose more buoyancy at depth. But not that much more....94 lbs is really loony. Think more in the 30-40 lb area for anything except technical diving in cold water with lots of extra gear, and if you're a new diver and a sensible person, it will be years before you find yourself in that position.

Search around this forum and you'll find lots of posts that discuss how to estimate lift needs; you can look especially for posts from Tobin at Deep Sea Supply. His username is cool_hardware (or something close). Basically you'll want to get the smallest wing you can use for the particular situation you're in. Water temp (and thus exposure protection) has the most impact on lift needs. Double tanks do not need more lift per-se, but since the tanks are spread on your back, you need a much wider wing to accommodate them. These wings almost always have more lift than a good single tank wing. No matter what anyone at a dive shop or in sales literature might claim, there simply is no wing that is good for single and double tanks, period.

So, think about a nice small 30 lb wing, like the oxycheq mach V, dive rite travel EXP, halcyon single wing, deep sea supply single tank set up, something like that. I'd also say goodbye to the idea of the 'comfort' straps. They won't improve the performance or comfort of the set up in the water, which is where you'll be using it. Good luck!

 

[chrpai]

We used to call them bungie wings of death. 94lbs is crazy! Totally agree... for signle tank mid-atlantic diving, no more then 40lbs. I dive a 27lb and I think that would be fine also.

Get a single tank rig with basic harness ( Hog / DIR / UTD style ) and dive dive dive dive. The other stuff will come later.