Diving without a dive master or guide.

[mathauck0814]

I've cancelled vacations when I found out that I had no choice but to dive with a DM. It's just not fun for me.

 

[nimoh]

Diveguide as in paid DM-ish person, I would say doesn' t exist in my neighbourhood. On holidays obviously they do, and chosing to use them depends on the site and the goal and my experience with that particular type of dive. 95% of these kind of dives where a DM is available I won't follow the DM. Not because I don't trust his experience, or better his knowledge of local fauna, etc... but just because I don't like "follow the leader, leader" kind of dives where 6 people are following a DM. DM shows frogfish... 4 of the 6 divers following take pictures and are running over themselves to get a good shot... well I rather leave that kind of hassle, and not see a frogfish.

However even in small buddy teams (2 - 3 persons) in my philosophy you are always planning the dive, and decide who will "lead" the dive...is responsible for navigation, deco profile, who will deploy the smb, etc. Most of the time the guy leading the dive (navigating) is the one who knows the place best... nothing wrong with that

I can agree with that. I will follow the divemaster, but my buddy and I will usually be at least 30 feet away and I find I get much better pictures this way. Trying to get a good angle is virtually impossible when 10 others are trying to do the same thing

 

[nimoh]

I've cancelled vacations when I found out that I had no choice but to dive with a DM. It's just not fun for me.

I think cancelling is a little extreme, but if more people did this, there would be a lot less DM requirements at resorts

 

[dmoore19]

I think cancelling is a little extreme, but if more people did this, there would be a lot less DM requirements at resorts

Not necessarily true. There are destinations that require DM's be in the water with you. Cozumel is a good example of this. Unless of course you are diving outside of the marine park.

 

[GrumpyOldGuy]

I've cancelled vacations when I found out that I had no choice but to dive with a DM. It's just not fun for me.

Why does a DM spoil your fun?
Seriously, not trying to pick a fight, just want to know.

I have no problems diving with a DM, most are good divers and sip gas, add the local knowledge and it can be good. Now the gaggle of tourist divers following him/her roto-tilling the bottom and it is a different problem.

 

[mathauck0814]

Why does a DM spoil your fun?
Seriously, not trying to pick a fight, just want to know.

I have no problems diving with a DM, most are good divers and sip gas, add the local knowledge and it can be good. Now the gaggle of tourist divers following him/her roto-tilling the bottom and it is a different problem.

It's the enforcement of "lowest common denominator" diving (or at least the chance that such can happen). Getting on a dive boat that's going to select a site, plan depths or times or having a DM set the pace for my dive based on the least experienced diver on the boat in my opinion ruins the fun. If someone hasn't dove since last year, has a SAC of 1.7 and is going to force me out of the water early or reroute the boat to a 20' reef when I wanted to do the 120' wreck it just causes more frustration than I've decided it's worth. I can't always afford to charter the whole boat for my purpose, so I pick destinations that are more friendly to the type of diving I want to do.

We are spoiled and get to dive three or four days a week in CA - none of those dives are guided. If we want to take our sweet time getting in or out of the water, cool, if we want to make an on-the-fly adjustment and make our dive 10 minutes longer, cool. In the Keys, Australia and other locations I have found operators where you have the freedom to dive your own plan and let others do the same - just let the crew know what you're doing and what your next/deeper/longer plan might be and when to call out the cavalry. In places like Mexico, Belize and Roatan it feels like they've instituted policies that do more to create employment opportunities for DMs than for the enjoyment of qualified divers and so I don't go there.

I don't deny that DM diving can be fun for some, but it's not for me. So on the couple of occasions where I found out late and felt like it would be too much of an obstacle I've made other plans.

 

[GrumpyOldGuy]

It's the enforcement of "lowest common denominator" diving....

I agree, group diving can really be dismal and group diving is typically is lead by a DM.
But the reverse is not always true, a DM/Guide does not have to be a group and a group is not always that bad if they are matched in skill levels.

Anyway, living in So Cal you can afford to be picky. The only reason I keep working for the same company is they send me to So Cal once a month and I get to stay an extra day for a dive boat to the Channel Islands. Spend a few years inland and you become more flexible.

 

[mathauck0814]

group diving can really be dismal and group diving is typically is lead by a DM.
But the reverse is not always true, a DM/Guide does not have to be a group and a group is not always that bad if they are matched in skill levels.

I get what you're saying, and I agree with you. We have made trips as a group that can fill a six-pack and then it's worthwhile. If I could go to Coz/Roatan and "opt out" of the group when it's not matched, I'd probably go. As it stands, it's not worth it to me to risk it when there are so many places that will allow me to dive the way I want to dive. I'd rather risk not seeing the SuperCoolDooHickey(tm) that the DM knows exactly where it lives than watch the cluster that ensues when said SuperCoolDooHickey(tm) is pointed out to the gaggle of dive-lemmings chasing the DM around.

 

[Saldiac]

I don't see myself diving without a dive master/guide any time soon. In contrast to the many very experienced divers with hundreds or thousands of dives, I've only done 56 dives so far. Maybe if I ever get to several hundreds dives I might change my mind.

 

[beester]

@ Mathauk: I agree, that's why I'm picky too, when choosing locations. However in most DM-abbundant locations (tropical) that I do there is no problem. On liveaboards other divers don't bother even tho their experience might be low, I dive my dive and they theirs. If I'm doing day-boats it can be a problem (selection of dive-location based on level of divers), however if you do some investigation before hand it works out fine. I went to Cozumel 2 years ago, there was a cattle-boat organisation on the premises of the hotel we were staying, but I had researched and made contact with a small op, that caters to the more experienced clientele. So no problem whatsoever to do follow the DM dives in Cozumel because the DM (and owner) took us to the places we wanted to see. Deploying your own SMB, no prob, doing deco-dives, no prob... just a check of credentials and a good look at you during the 1st dive to see if your credentials match your attitude in the water... and all was well.