Yukon tangent thread

[lamont]

If belly down, then heart attack, then regulator falls out of the mouth, then freeflow: freeflow can empty a tank also ... even postmortem.

I've seen it a number of times.

At which point, though, it makes the accident completely unpreventable (from scuba perspective -- outside of lifestyle changes) and means that the timeframe is even shorter since now he died before his tanks were empty.

 

[Bubbletrubble]

Like I said, I've tried a variety of tasks such as you suggest. These have included putting together puzzles, solving medium difficulty multiplication problems, or writing a phrase backward. I have tried it with the surface trial first and with the deep trial first. I have tried it with the surface trial in the water and out of the water. A significant percentage of AOW students do these tasks faster at depth simply because they are more focused. Others have trouble at depth but cite specific causes such as numb fingers or dim ambient light.

@Scot M: Have you tried "stacking" the tasks while having the subject attend to other things? I'm pretty sure that with a little creative thought you could come up with a set of modifiable tasks that teaches the students there is cognitive impairment at depth. Numb fingers and a lack of ambient light can be controlled for by altering study design.

I'm just trying to give suggestions here. I don't have the experience you have as a scuba instructor. However, I think you'll agree that this is a worthwhile thing to teach students about deep diving. At the very least, it will encourage the students to dive more conservatively once the class ends.

 

[Scot M]

This isn't a study. It's a recreational scuba class. Yes, I could task load the students until they showed impairment under mild narcosis but that won't benefit learning, especially at the AOW level. As I mentioned, this is no longer part of the PADI AOW course anyway, so I'm going to have to put my "little creative thought" into teaching the students to monitor their gauges frequently.

[Edit: I'm going to let this tangent drop, but I would be happy to discuss it on a more appropriate thread.]

 

[Cruisin Home]

Wow, I finally read all the POSTS and what a bunch of off topic stuff!

conclusions I draw for what its worth:
1) this is an accident, and like auto accidents people often make mistakes. The object of this board is to try and see if there is useful lessons learned, particularly for the inexperienced.
2) The Dive Charter made a mistake, and admitted it. Wow what guts it takes in tto admit a mistake these days! I applaud that owners response. I think this poor man's death (he was a vetran as I) will have at least accomplished some good in bringing attention to Roll calls on large charters! But thats enough, dont beat it in the ground the man screwed up, admitted it, said he was sorry, and will bring about change. We all know it didnt contribute to death.
3) Solo. Its every divers choice. I have done it thousands of time as I was commercial shellfish diver, (hard to get buddie everyday)! There are risks with buddies and risks solo, it's your life, you decide.
4) We don't know what caused death but let me bring one point that I think has not been mentioned : When we do deep wreck diving in cold New England, most guys dive solo, but they have backup everything in case of any failures etc. I dont see aproblem with him doing a short 100foot dive with AL80 but in this day in age it is inexpensive to have backup pony bottle and reg. for those novice and perhaps even experienced: dont cut corners and dive to this depth solo and not have small reserve gas/reg. It's just taking a chance. A chance this man took and likely came up on the losing end.

let's try and be positive in our investigation and what can be learned. Any comments on my reserve gas/reg are welcomed.

Just the Opinion of an old new england salt

 

[Adobo]

Read back, it is on topic. People asked for me to give and example of a rescue that could have helped. I just so happened to have a real example of one of mine. If you can't see the value in it then ignore it and move on.

Actually, I personally was asking how a proper roll call and subsequent rescue attempt would have played out to help this diver under these circumstances. The example you gave did not even remotely resemble the scenario that this person was in.

If we are at liberty to change the scenario to whatever we want then I can contrive a scenario wherein the lack of duct tape and chewing gum would be the root cause of the incident.

 

[Jax]

If we are at liberty to change the scenario to whatever we want then I can contrive a scenario wherein the lack of duct tape and chewing gum would be the root cause of the incident.

Dare ya!

 

[D_B]

This guy needs to stop calling the shots from the high desert 8 hours from San Diego, especially since you have no direct knowledge of the incident and others here do.

The Humboldt did return to the Yukon. Called MAYDAY on the radio and initiated the emergency response, although an hour too late. The LG reported to the Humboldt crew and owners that the tank was empty.

Please list your source where you claim that they did not return to the Yukon? How do you know this? You must have good binoculars.

Are you sure that was the sequence of events reguarding the Humbolt , that they first returned to the Yukon and then called for help and that was an hour later

the RubyE is only about 15 or so minutes away from the Yukon

 

[mdb]

It is very interesting to see the various pundits, most who have never been diving at this location, offering their opinions.

There is something to be learned from this divers death, and it will, most likely, come from those who were actually there, on site, or, at least, those who have actually been on the same dive site.

 

[Fish-R-Man]

After reading through tghis lengthy thread, I believe there may be one more scenario that has been over looked.

Is it possible that:

1) He was inattentive due to the fact that he was packing a camera and possible narcosis
2) He realized late in the dive that he was low on air and started for the surface. Once on his deco stop he finally sucked the bottle dry. To conserve air, he did not fully inflate his BC and maintained bouyancy by slowly swimming or hanging onto one of the mooring lines. He was controlling his breathing to conserve air, so it may not have been that apparent that he was there from the surface.
3) As he reached the surface he was OOA and slightly negative.
4) At the moment he reached the surface, he was struck by the departing dive boat. Not hard enough to cause injury or show outward signs of trauma, but enough to cause him to ingest water into his lungs.
5) Now he is OOA, negative, drowning and slowly sinking back to the bottom.

Not to lay blame on the dive boat and crew, but they should not have left with out everyone accounted for.....

 

[diverrex]

After reading through tghis lengthy thread, I believe there may be one more scenario that has been over looked.

Is it possible that:

1) He was inattentive due to the fact that he was packing a camera and possible narcosis
2) He realized late in the dive that he was low on air and started for the surface. Once on his deco stop he finally sucked the bottle dry. To conserve air, he did not fully inflate his BC and maintained bouyancy by slowly swimming or hanging onto one of the mooring lines. He was controlling his breathing to conserve air, so it may not have been that apparent that he was there from the surface.
3) As he reached the surface he was OOA and slightly negative.
4) At the moment he reached the surface, he was struck by the departing dive boat. Not hard enough to cause injury or show outward signs of trauma, but enough to cause him to ingest water into his lungs.
5) Now he is OOA, negative, drowning and slowly sinking back to the bottom.

Not to lay blame on the dive boat and crew, but they should not have left with out everyone accounted for.....

or maybe he was struck by lightning