Definition of "Open Water?"

[knowone]

A great open water dive is where there is obstruction to descend. Every dive is a deco dive.

 

[JamesBon92007]

If by "decompression dives" you mean dives where you have to make decompression stops, then, as seaducer indicated, that's not taught in any recreational course (at least not now -- I don't think) other than for an emergency situation.


In my case, my wife and I were certified in 1986, and dived casually until 1991 just after the kids started coming. When our oldest turned 14 in 2004, he did his OWD; my wife and I decided to sit in with him and audit the entire course after our 13-year break. It was "just like riding a bike" once in the water; but a lot had changed in just the 13 years regarding equipment, techniques, procedures, etc.

Just sayin'.

Well, we were "taught" how to do decompression dives but didn't actually do any in the course. I have only dived with a single 72 or 80 so I can recall only one time where I had to consult the tables before diving and actually made a stop at 10' for whatever the amount of time that was indicated. For me a decompression dive is something you have to plan. I suppose with a dive computer you could throw on some double 72s and not pay any attention to how deep you are or how long you've been down and hopefully have a spare tank and regulator and hopefully it's on a secure line and at the correct depth blah blah blah....

Yes, some things have changed but I saw most of it coming and it sure seems like a lot of it was designed to keep dive shops prosperous. Not that I have anything against dive shops making money but I sure don't want someone, someday, telling me I'm not qualified to dive from their boat etc because my C-Card does not say AOW on it. So basically I'm just trying to find out what my level of certification is by today's standards. From what I've read it sounds like AOW or so. I also tried to get a replacement C-Card from NAUI but their records only go back to 1970. Hmmm. Makes me wonder. The good news is that I found my old C-Cards, including the original cardboard card. Back then is was an extra $5 to get a nice plastic one.

When my wife got certified in 1983 I took the course with her because I was beginning to have some doubts about the available training, mainly based upon my experience with other "certified" divers who, in my opinion, were not quite ready to go diving. Her instructor was former Navy UDT and commercial diver. He was a very good instructor. She is a very good diver. About the only thing that was new (other than nicer gauge consoles, BCs, and aluminum tanks) was the instructor suggested I add a couple more pounds of weight to improve my swimming position on the surface. I've read many threads here about buoyancy control and DIR and I wonder if anyone is having fun any more.

 

[JamesBon92007]

PADI defines „Open Water“ as following:
“Open water is a body of water significantly larger than a swimming pool offering conditions typical of a natural body of water encountered by divers.”

PADI Instructor Manual Version 2010 (Rev. 1/10), General Standards and Procedures Guide, Page 17.

This might sound silly but is there a NON-Open Water certification? I mean, can someone get a "Swimming Pool" certification? No wonder I'm having touble understanding this certification-level business. Presumably someone would be required to get an OW certification before they can get a Cave Diving cert.

 

[MikeMeagher]

I got certified in the 70's, became an Instructor in the 80's, now just dive for fun... but it's been interesting to see how the SCUBA industry has morphed over the years. More and more granular levels of courses over time being offered (my guess is so that there are more training options to offer and thus more potential for continuing education and revenue streamd) and its interesting to see how some diving practices that were formerly frowned opon by many agencies years ago (multil level diving, deco diving, mixed gasses topics) are nowdays acceptable advanced training topics.

 

[Doc Intrepid]

"Open Water" has also been referred to as "confined water", in that it implies conditions that are relatively controlled - a small bay, a lake, a tidal pool (which is what we used on Guam),...in other words, water that is not moving or impacted by surge, intense currents, or other impediments to students performing basic skills.


Unless something has recently changed in the definition, "open water" was not originally intended to imply "non-overhead diving" as opposed to "overhead diving" - for the reason that PADI did not teach courses that involved overhead diving when the term was first used. All PADI diving courses discussed, de facto, "non-overhead diving". Even the wreck diving course essentially involved swimming around the exterior of a sunken vessel, not penetrating inside it.

FWIW.

 

[Blue982]

As far as I know, BSAC does decompression diving at their Sports Diver level, which is one above their basic Ocean Diver level.

 

[Marek K]

I can recall only one time where I had to consult the tables before diving

Um, say that again?

I sure don't want someone, someday, telling me I'm not qualified to dive from their boat etc because my C-Card does not say AOW on it.

I don't think anyone, anywhere would tell you you're not certified.

What I have noticed more recently is that a lot more dive operations, maybe it's just in the "touristy" areas, are paying a lot more attention to the currency (no pun intended) of a diver's experience.

Our whole family has just gone three years now without diving -- we moved back to the States from Europe, and time and money have been a bit tight. We're now planning a dive trip to the Cayman Islands this summer, and the operation there is requiring a refresher course for divers who haven't been diving for two years or more.

In the "old days" (1980's for us), it was common for an operation to check a diver's skills in the pool prior to taking them out. Then, five years ago or so, requiring an open-water (there's that term again) check-out dive with a divemaster was the norm, at least at the Red Sea.

Here and now, the operation is asking $100 a person for their refresher course :shocked2:, but they don't mind a bit if the refresher is done at home before we get there. They also don't seem to be real picky about requirements for the refresher -- they just want some kind of logbook entry and stamp from the shop that does it.

We were planning on doing a pool session anyway, to make sure our equipment still works, that our weighting is still good with growing kids, and so on. We will get a logbook stamp, and that should satisfy the dive operation.

Hey, one big change you're going to find is the absolute prohibition these days against touching anything natural underwater -- particularly the reefs... unless it's an emergency. I find that a good thing, seeing how much damage can be done. That's why the stress on proper bouyancy and weighting.

DIR [...] I wonder if anyone is having fun any more.

Yeah, it's still fun... even for the DIR guys and gals. :mooner:

 

[Marek K]

"Open Water" has also been referred to as "confined water", in that it implies conditions that are relatively controlled - a small bay, a lake, a tidal pool (which is what we used on Guam),...in other words, water that is not moving or impacted by surge, intense currents, or other impediments to students performing basic skills.

If anything, I'd say that "open water" has always been the opposite of "confined water." In that regard, I agree with explorer08's definition in Post #5. Confined water would a very controlled environment, like a swimming pool or the confined tidal pool. "Open water" would be, well, unconfined.

The term "open water" seems to be quite broad, though. When my wife and I were getting OW qualified in 1986, according to our logbooks our first two "open water" dives were in a small pond in North Carolina averaging 15 ft. My last two OW dives were way out in the Gulf Stream off of Wrightsville Beach, down to almost 70 ft., in 4-6' seas -- wife got so seasick that she had to abort. Her last two OW dives were in a calm quarry down to about 30 ft.

Unless something has recently changed in the definition, "open water" was not originally intended to imply "non-overhead diving" as opposed to "overhead diving"

I think you're right, but I also think that a de-facto alternate definition now for OW is "non-overhead and non-mandatory deco stop." And I don't think it's a bad one.

 

[Mike Boswell]

I also think that a de-facto alternate definition now for OW is "non-overhead and non-mandatory deco stop." And I don't think it's a bad one.

Is it not true that a PADI AOW diver who has taken the Wreck Specialty can penetrate wrecks?

I am getting confused.

 

[knowone]

You're getting confused. I'm got. padi AOW book chapter WRECK DIVING.... page 356. "Your Wreck Adventure Dive may be credited (at the instructor's discretion) toward the PADI Wreck Diver Specialty certification. In addition to what you've learned in this section and will practice on the Wreck Adventure Dive, the PADI Wreck Diver Specialty course includes: Penetration techniques. Wreck mapping. Origin of wreck diving laws. Researching wrecks"....page 352 "The techniques for shipwreck penetration are beyond the scope of this section"....page 350 "Don't swim under anything that could fall on you." Lucky me. I don't think I did a Wreck Adventure Dive, maybe I did and it just wasn't very adventurous....page 353 "Obviously entering wrecks is an activity reserved for those trained and equipped to handle these hazards. If you find that wreck penetration is something you have an interest in, enrolling in a PADI Wreck Diver Specialty course can teach you the techniques for limited, recreational penetration wreck dives. Ask your instructor specifically about wreck penetration and whether you make such a dive in the course (it's optional)." What are instructor's or students responsibilities after having read this piffle.