Which mirrorless system for UW..e-pl3 vs gf2 vs sony nex-5n?

[cheetohcat]

Well, the time has come...after 2 years of frequent diving with my Canon S90 set up (and getting a lot of it!), I am ready to upgrade! Instead of jumping to a dSLR, I am really interested in the mirrorless compact systems.

First let me say, I adore the compactness of my s90 gear, but I do find the picture quality, lack of moveable focus points, and slower focus speed (compared to a dSLR) a drawback. I do enjoy shooting both WA and macro so ideally I'd like to move to a system that can also shoot both UWA and macro, assuming I have the right lenses and ports of course and address the other needs.

I've narrowed it down to the Olympus e-pl3, Panasonic gf2 or Sony nex-5n. If anyone experience with one or more of these for UW, would love to hear your thoughts.

It's a big decision and I don't want to make an expensive mistake! :blinking:


______

Canon S90, FIX housing, 2x strobes, Ring Flash, FIX UWL-04, 2x Inon UCL-165M67, Sola 600, Go Pro.​

 

[bullshark]

I have been looking at these things for over a year and none of these are acceptable to me.

The Sony lenses are not good nor competitive. The NEX 7 would be the one to get if you are going to suffer the lenses but its not available and neither are the housings.

The Oly P3 is better than the PL/3 but neither is capable of ISO100 or ISO80. They just can't get the noise out or they are withholding lower noise ISO for a newer "improved" model P-4. Meanwhile, the management of Olympus is morally bankrupt having falsified corporate financial statements to hide losses and only just avoided delisting on the Tokyo Stock exchange. I worry that they would falsify other things...

The GF2 is just OK. It is the only one of the bunch that does ISO 100, but it is clearly not the leader in the Panasonic line, the GX1 is. The GF2 is widely criticized for lack of manual controls and especially for U/W: there is no flash exposure compensation control.

I believe that all the M43 makers are "holding back" so as not to cannibalize their DSLR sales.

I am also waiting for Nikon or Canon to enter the fray, if they can...

The expense of housing these cameras is just too high for me to consider a mediocre or crippled camera body.

 

[Tigerman]

Why not go for DSLR? A cheap DSLR is going to be better than any 4/3rds system and the housings is not THAT much more expensive for DSLRs?

 

[tarjan]

tigerman, the housings for the m4/3 olympus cameras are available under a grand. 10bar for panasonic runs about 1.1k. Compared to dSLR you are looking at 2.5k and then you need ports, so yes it is an extreme difference, not to mention the size is much, much smaller.

I have a GF2 in a 10bar case. The case works fine, though I really dislike the controls for zooming and changing the back dial, but the buttons are great. The springs on everything that twists have a lot of resistance and it slips on the gears so smooth adjustment is hard. It DOES work and you rarely need to adjust zoom or focus but... The back dial is easier, you just set it so it is on the opposite thing you want to adjust (exposure if you want to adjust shutter) press it all the way in, hold it (so it switches to what you want) and spin to adjust.

The lack of FEC is a real issue, though I haven't had too many problems with it. Much bigger problem on land when you want to just do a fill flash but under water I just switch from TTL to manual on my strobe. Hopefully the coming GF2 hack can add this back, but no guarantees and I haven't seen people hitting up vitaly with any positive results.

That being said, if I were looking at a new system I would go olympus and stick with their cases. They are much more optimized for the camera and TTL does NOT require the built in flash to fully fire if combined with an oly strobe. This means the recycle time is drastically reduced and the newest models have very fast focus times.

Keep in mind you need to get a few lenses, most will suggest the ultra wide zoom as well as the 45mm macro. This is good advice, I've been using the 14-42 and.. it just isn't wide enough. Lighting under water is just so difficult that you need to get uber close. At 14mm you can't stay close enough to get proper lighting on many things. You are looking at about 2500 if you already have a strobe, 3200 if you don't. I can go on a liveaboard with two bags and a weeks clothing, my drysuit and everything else as carry-on. (Dive caddy and laptop bag)

SLR would come in around 5-5.5k and there is no way you are going to get it and your stuff there without checking.

BTW, the sony would be my suggestion if the lenses and cases were available. Under water the larger sensor is a big deal but not THAT big of a deal to deal with the dearth of available equipment. Also ignore the iso thing. 200iso in the oly is equiv to 100iso in the gf2. There are no gains to be had there.

 

[Tigerman]

Theres plenty of housings for DSLR WAY cheaper than 2,5k.. More like 12-1500.
Yes, its plus ports, but if you want proper WA and Macro youll need to go there anyways..

Ikelite housing for a Canon 50D for example would be one of those at $1500 and all the ikelite housing include TTL circuitry..

 

[RonFrank]

I have been considering a 4/3 setup due to the size. I have a D200 UW so no lectures on the DSLR please! I enjoy shooting the big camera but traveling with that, plus all the other gear gets old. Now with airlines charging for bags it is becomming impractical to haul all my stuff.

The new PL3 seems to be the 4/3rd I have been waiting for. The real news is the PL3 focus is as fast as the D3x which is incredible and something I have been waiting for. Here is a quote:

"From far to near, near to far, across middle distances, focusing on faces, round shiny objects, glass windows, over and over these new cameras just lock on immediately. I didn’t experience any hunting or hesitation. The responsiveness of the E-P3 and E-PL3 is in a whole other league from previous Olympus Micro Four Thirds cameras. Very high end DSLR-like."

I think the kit lens (14mm-42mm) is a good jumping off point for me. The housing is $800 so more than the camera, but it has a built-in AF assist light. I need to read a bit more but the concept is sound. There does not appear to be a great option for macro. I like macro, so that is a negative, or at least until they come out with something. They make a cheap plastic filter, and I already own some diopters so I will look into that as well.

I am in no rush but the E-PL3 seems like a good compromise between my DSLR and a PnS.

 

[Kevster]

I have the GH2 & nauticam housing. Small, excellent video but set up was expensive.
Olympus are about to release the OM-D which is expected to be class leading

 

[tarjan]

Panasonic 45mm lens is great underwater, but you would be stuck at 45mm. I use a 67mm macro wet lens and it churns out great pics combined with the 14-42. I wish i had the 9-18 though.

tiger: You are correct, I was unware of that one but it is still 1500+port and zoom gear costs (about 2k total for wide and normal). for 1.1k you get the 10bar case with two ports and gears. Some get hopped up about poly vs metal (ike is poly it seems), but that is not important to me. Still the thing is HUGE compared to m4/3 and the 10bar does include electrical connections, just no TTL converter (which is a terrible mistake IMO).

 

[bullshark]

Also ignore the iso thing. 200iso in the oly is equiv to 100iso in the gf2. There are no gains to be had there.

Tarjan,

Please provide a cite/reference for your advice about ISO. I would like to know more about this and understand why some cameras cannot offer ISO100 or ISO80 and/or why this doesn't matter, which seems to fly in the face of experience.

 

[gsk3]

The thing about ISO is correct. Some cameras have lower ISOs than their "base" ISO, so lower ISOs actually have lower quality.