When should I stop referring to myself as a beginner

[boulderjohn]

What was he diving those 800 dives?

A few years ago a woman participated in a thread and presented herself as a highly experienced and accomplished diver. She claimed 200 logged dives, and that is very possible. She explained that she goes on several cruises a year, and she dives on those cruises. That is how she got all her dives over a 20 year period.

I would imagine many people have hundreds of dives in fish bowl conditions and have no experience with anything else.

 

[Dogbowl]

An aquarium in the states, Florida keys, Bahamas, Fiji, Philippines and a couple other warm water spots I forget. Lots of stories and had worked as a DM for a while too.

I see...ok, cold water is a different beast altogether but that still surprises me.

 

[ScubaJill]

Thanks for all the comments - most insightful.

There is a practical reason why I’ve asked this. Whenever I initiate correspondence with a dive op who don’t know me, or when I post here and want to put what I say into the proper context, I often will say that I’m a beginner. I think that sets the right context for my opinions in SB and the dive ops will know not to expect too much of me in terms of skills (as an aside, I have a lot of diving knowledge which I got here, but not skills because I literally haven’t dived enough). But after say, 50 dives, if I still think I’m not “good enough”, can I still legitimately call myself a beginner or will people start thinking I’m full of BS?

When communicating with dive shops, I usually tell them the number of dives I have, the dive environments, and what equipment I will be bringing/need. I let them make their own decision about how to describe my experience level. Beginner/advanced is so relative.

 

[TMHeimer]

I'll chime in again seconding the idea of providing helpful information about your dive desires and comfort levels. Particularly in new environments.

My most memorable experience related to this was an instructor candidate who had towards 800 dives and considered himself an experienced diver, talked a great talk and had tons of dive stories.

However, he had never descended using a visual reference in somewhat low visibility (6ft) and was not comfortable in a full wetsuit. The pond we dove to 35ft was entirely beyond his ability to cope.

The resulting panic and bolt to the surface left us suprised and himself shaken.

A few better descriptive terms would have been helpful in his case.

Regards,
Cameron

A good example of a very experienced diver in some areas/conditions could be a complete beginner elsewhere. A related discussion is "What number of dives and what sort of experience should I have before turning pro?" Depends. Personally I'd rather take a course from an instructor who was an expert in the conditions where the course dives take place (and not much experience elsewhere)--as opposed to one who has dived all over the world, but has limited experience locally. Having both is of course the best situation.

 

[scubafanatic]

I'd summarize your dive experience to the dive op, let them know where you've dove (locations, depths, land-based vs live aboard, night dives, drift dives, ocean vs lake/quarry) with emphasis on any experiences similar to your chosen destination. With your 'background' they can make a better assessment of your real-world experience level. When you arrive and begin diving at your destination, they will watch you (as they watch all new-to-them, untested divers) as you gear up, set your computer, work your Nitrox analyzer, determine your weighting, and do your 'get acquainted' dives to make a realistic assessment of where they think you rank on their experience/comfort level.

 

[diversteve]

when you have more dives than the DM leading the dive - some places you're 1/2 way there....

 

[JohnnyC]

Beginner is relative. I'm a cave diver, CCR diver, technical diver. I am confident in my abilities in all of those areas. However, I am still a beginner relative to many divers. I am also very experienced relative to a great many others. I have several friends that have quite a few more dives than I do, but they've only ever made one type of calm, warm water, shallow, sand kicking seahorse swimming reef dive. Who's actually the beginner?

Point is, compared to many, I'm not a beginner, compared to others, I'm still wet behind the ears. It's all relative to the dive. If I'm diving rec limits off a boat, I tell an op I'm an experienced AOW diver and that generally more than suffices. On occasion, I'm even a PADI DM, but it's very rare, it's almost exclusively with friends, and it's usually a way for a shop to get more paying customers than they'd normally have staff for, while giving me some free air in return. Sometimes I'm a beginner, sometimes I'm a pro, sometimes I'm just highly experienced.

 

[Neilwood]

I'll chime in again seconding the idea of providing helpful information about your dive desires and comfort levels. Particularly in new environments.

My most memorable experience related to this was an instructor candidate who had towards 800 dives and considered himself an experienced diver, talked a great talk and had tons of dive stories.

However, he had never descended using a visual reference in somewhat low visibility (6ft) and was not comfortable in a full wetsuit. The pond we dove to 35ft was entirely beyond his ability to cope.

The resulting panic and bolt to the surface left us suprised and himself shaken.

A few better descriptive terms would have been helpful in his case.

Regards,
Cameron

I can totally understand how people can become divers like that.

I learned in UK waters which basically means thick wetsuit or drysuit year round and good vis in anything from 5-10M ( anything over 10 is something to put in the diary and celebrate!). The long and short of this is that you learn from the start how to manage being good buddies, carrying decent amounts of lead, coping with buoyancy swings (or suit venting with drysuit), operating your gear with gloves and a hood etc. If you have only ever dived in warm blue water, you have probably not learned how to manage any of those issues as vis will be 25-30m+, you will probably only have shorts and a rash vest.

If I stray 2m sometimes on a dive here, it is more than likely a lost buddy situation however 10-15m would be no problem in blue water.

 

[homerdoc]

As I was packing for a trip that wife is going to get certified at Ginnie Springs, I read this thread, and was like, I have cold water dive dives, no vis dives, dives off the end of my pier to fix a pump, and 3 trips with oogles of dives at Bonaire.

I thought I was pretty experienced

As I was trying to get the regulators in the confounded cases, and basically stuffed them in like a bunch of Christmas lights in Kmart plastic bag and forced the zipper closed.

I think I will meekly ask my wifes instructor how to do it while I am with them on the dives. I will do out of earshot of other certified divers

We can always learn something.

 

[jlcnuke]

A few years ago a woman participated in a thread and presented herself as a highly experienced and accomplished diver. She claimed 200 logged dives, and that is very possible. She explained that she goes on several cruises a year, and she dives on those cruises. That is how she got all her dives over a 20 year period.

I would imagine many people have hundreds of dives in fish bowl conditions and have no experience with anything else.

By this time next year I fully expect to be well over 50 dives (liveaboard, Cozumel trip, and probably another dive trip between now and then). I'll have "shore dives, ocean dives, boat dives, quarry dives, drift dives, etc" but I have no plans to have any dives in zero vis, or water colder than I'd use a 3mm wetsuit for, etc. In fact, I don't currently plan on doing any dives needing anything more than that at all. There are literally thousands of places I can dive that are warm, decent/good visibility locations. Now, I may decide to get into other types of diving at some point in the future, but there's no reason I'd have to. Never using a dry suit wouldn't make me a "bad" or "inexperienced" diver, it would just be one type of diving/gear that I don't have experience with.

While I think it's great/preferable if a person teaching an OW class in 3 ft vis in 40F water is very experienced in such conditions and with the gear required for that kind of dive, I don't think that means lacking such experience means the instructor teaching the same class in Bonaire is a "beginner" if they've never put on a dry suit. A 747 captain isn't a beginner pilot just because there are lots of other planes they have no experience flying after all.