What's with sidemount?

[MXGratefulDiver]

I'm not offended or grimacing at anyone, I'm just trying to figure out if it's a fad, if it's cool factor, or if, as PADI says, it's the diving wave of the future.

It's a fad ... like backplates and nitrox ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[DA Aquamaster]

To extend and takes Bob's post place words in his mouth and taek it in a direction he never intended, Bob is correct that all of the major innovations were for the most part ctritisized by the old mossbacks in the bunch.

So...just starting this tread suggests potential advancing age and crustiness.

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I have serious reservations about side mount diving off a boat, especially in rough seas.

It's something I'd consider off a six pack a mile or two off Miami Beach where the seas are predictable and the mechanics of both getting in and getting back aboard with not only the primary tanks but also the stage and deco bottles are different than on a larger crew boat or live-aboard. But obviously, I still have a set of doubles, BPO and wing for all the other times when sidemount seems less appealing or less optimum.

However, my house also looks like a dive shop, one that has opened a branch location at Marci's house. Some people have suggestred that it may not be typical for a diver to own vintage double hose, single tank pretty fish diving, doubles diving and sidmount doubles diving rigs. I regard them all as tools that have unique applications, but it's a lot of stuff and over time it represents a large outlay of cash. If I had to limit myself to just one, and only one configuration for the rest of my diving career for use in all diivng environments, a sidemount configuration would be a serious contender as it is very flexible with a broad range of applications - but then again so is a back mounted doubles configuration, the difference is just in where each offers pros and cons in a given environment.

In that regard, a sidemount configuration is, like the .40 S&W, a bit of a compromise in that a sidemount configuration that is useful in large number of environments will not be optimum in any of them. That becomes a major factor to consider, and if "optimum" matters, then you'll find yourself gravitating toward multiple configurations.

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FWIW, Lamar Hire's intention in designing/evolving the Nomad was to create one rig that coudl be used in wide variety of situations from sidemount to back mount doubles to singel tank - but that also by design implies the need to change betwene the three in different situations.

 

[Wookie]

... I'm curious what that "wrong situation" might be?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

on the deck of a heaving dive boat in 4-6 foot seas, whether fully kitted up and trying to waddle to the jump gate with cylinders swinging this way and that (applies to those who don't have their rigs fully tuned yet), or trying to get in and have their cylinders handed down to them from 6 feet high. Your sidemount instructor was the first diver we've ever had dive sidemount from the Spree, and he did fine. Others who came later got through the process without managing to kill themselves. I just don't see it as a best case scenario for all situations. When someone tells me "I dive sidemount", I want to tell them that I can rig that way too, and would if I had any reason too. I dive with a snorkel. Not often, and only if I think I will spend a long time on the surface, because a snorkel is a tool. It helps me accomplish things I can't otherwise accomplish if I didn't have it.

To repeat. I have nothing against sidemount. I just don't get it. I didn't get BP&W before I tried it, either.

 

[theskull]

I started diving SideMount in January for one reason only: PADI's pesky rule that you must be a SideMount Instructor if you teach Tech Deep to a diver who is using SideMount. Then the unexpected happened and I found that I prefer diving SideMount to my backmount doubles that I loved. Soon I sold all my backmount gear and now dive SideMount for everything (except the occasional BM single tank dives in tropical locations and some OW classes).

Late this summer I had the opportunity to dive off a boat in Lake Michigan in aggressive wave conditions. Getting geared up to jump in was a little more time consuming than shrugging on a set of doubles, but the giant stride entry was no different, and climbing the ladder at the end of the dive was a little easier with the center of gravity lower and closer to the ladder.

Are there some trade-offs? Yes, fer sure fer sure. But they are well worth it!

theskull

 

[Wookie]

To extend and takes Bob's post place words in his mouth and taek it in a direction he never intended, Bob is correct that all of the major innovations were for the most part ctritisized by the old mossbacks in the bunch.

So...just starting this tread suggests potential advancing age and crustiness.


FWIW, Lamar Hire's intention in designing/evolving the Nomad was to create one rig that coudl be used in wide variety of situations from sidemount to back mount doubles to singel tank - but that also by design implies the need to change betwene the three in different situations.

What, you expect me to argue my crustiness? Or advancing age?

What Lamar told me is what makes me ask the question in the first place.

 

[The Chairman]

... I'm curious what that "wrong situation" might be?

For me, its getting back onto the boat in heavy seas. I don't do sidemount off of a boat for this very reason. At the springs, it's easier on me all the way around. On a boat, it only complicates things.

Its a matter of preference, really. Some people have an agenda to show how their choice is THE BEST no matter what. That happened with BP&Wings and its happening now with sidemount. You'll read right here on ScubaBoard, that BP&Wings are far better than any traditional BC, which is total horse hockey. It might be better for a particular individual, but for me there are def better solutions out there for diving a singles tank. As a former Master Certified Automotive Technician, people are often amazed at how I can do so much with a single tool. You can bet that the only time I do that is when I don't have access to ALL my tools. If I see an automotive technician use the same tool removing a wheel as they use to remove a spark-plug, I am going to assume that something is wrong. They don't own an adequate tool assortment, have lost them or they are simply incompetent. Heck, I must have a couple dozen different sockets just for removing spark plugs not to mention the variety of tools I have for taking a wheel off of a vehicle. When it comes to doing anything competently: Use the Right Tool for the Job. Notice I didn't say to use the SAME tool: Use the RIGHT tool.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

on the deck of a heaving dive boat in 4-6 foot seas, whether fully kitted up and trying to waddle to the jump gate with cylinders swinging this way and that (applies to those who don't have their rigs fully tuned yet), or trying to get in and have their cylinders handed down to them from 6 feet high.

I had some reservations about that before my Channel Islands trip ... and had some "experimenting" to do getting out of the water in rough seas during my 11 dives there. What I discovered is that I can as easily climb a ladder in sidemount doubles as in backmount doubles ... and it's easier to walk across deck in them because my CoG is lower. About the only real drawback I discovered is that dive boats really aren't built for sidemount ... the gate's too narrow, and requires you to giant-stride at an angle. This can be a problem if you don't pay attention to what you're doing with your fins.

Swinging cylinders suggests to me that someone's not configuring them properly ... wouldn't this be an argument in favor of a class to learn how to do it right?

Your sidemount instructor was the first diver we've ever had dive sidemount from the Spree, and he did fine. Others who came later got through the process without managing to kill themselves.

Again, this seems to answer the question "why take a class" ... because when you know how to do something properly, it generally makes it easier to avoid killing yourself.

I just don't see it as a best case scenario for all situations.

There is no such thing ... regardless of what configuration you're talking about.

When someone tells me "I dive sidemount", I want to tell them that I can rig that way too, and would if I had any reason too. I dive with a snorkel. Not often, and only if I think I will spend a long time on the surface, because a snorkel is a tool. It helps me accomplish things I can't otherwise accomplish if I didn't have it.

Why tell them anything? Do you typically discuss your feelings about your client's dive equipment ... particularly in a way that might put them on the defensive? Doesn't seem like a good business approach to me.

To repeat. I have nothing against sidemount. I just don't get it. I didn't get BP&W before I tried it, either.

... so next time Rob comes diving on your boat, why not ask him to bring a rig along so you can try it?

I agree with you that it's not an end-all, be-all ... but everyone's gotta make a decision about the equipment that best suits their diving goals and preferences ... and most folks don't generally keep multiple rigs around for different situations. I sold all my back-mount doubles equipment once I learned sidemount ... when I need doubles, I'll use what I have. Only kept the singles stuff because I need it when I teach.

Whatever floats your boat ... but as a boat owner, here's something to keep in mind ... some of the crew on The Peace made me pretty uncomfortable with their comments about my choice to dive sidemount. Although I have generally enjoyed my time on that boat, I will definitely think twice about going back out on it again. Boat crew and owners need to keep in mind that some clients don't enjoy having to justify their choices in dive equipment ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

FWIW, Lamar Hire's intention in designing/evolving the Nomad was to create one rig that coudl be used in wide variety of situations from sidemount to back mount doubles to singel tank - but that also by design implies the need to change betwene the three in different situations.

I wouldn't consider using my Nomad for backmount ... particularly not for singles. I learned long ago that any rig that's designed for multiple applications doesn't do any of them optimally. It's a fine rig for sidemount, although I've got some ideas for simplifying the harness a bit (someday, when I get a round tuit) ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[BabyDuck]

i dive sidemount because my boyfriend makes me. that, and the cool factor...i have to be cool.

 

[wedivebc]

I don't generally dive OC sidemount but I do sidemount my rebreather bailout tanks. When diving off a boat I hang them (usually 2 80s) off a line and put them on in the water. Way easier than bashing around on a pitching deck.