what can be considered a loggable dive?

[elan]

Pools and quarries are ersatz experiences and neither beats getting out in the real world and diving. What matters is experience and skill. Being able to execute a Praying Buddha in the pool has it's place but isn't nearly as important as being able to hold your position on a safety stop in rough water with a current. Badge collecting is silly and leads to chasing numbers. Developing skills and abilities is where your focus should be. I learn more about a student's abilities by watching him gear up and jump in the water than I do by reviewing his logbook.

There is a reasoning in your words , I do not log pools but... pool is as good as the skills you are doing in it. One training session that my friend does with his buddies in the pool working on the skills including all the valve drills, stage switching etc, etc that makes everybody "sweat" I would not put on par with a lazy reef dive watching the fish.

Besides quarries can be different , would you take a lazy dive in a 20 ft quarry at the same price as dive to the bottom of a 120ft quarry with no reference ascends and descends and holding a set of stops and possible decompression? or say a dive under the ice in a quarry I would say no.

The point is that the dives are as good as the complexity of skills you are applying in that dive.

 

[Lead_carrier]

For this you would have to have a SAC rate of 0.35 cuf

I will hardly believe a guy would have such a rate after 50 dives in 38F water, still learning how to use the dry suit Especially if he used it for suit and BCD inflation and consuidering once he gets into the water he loses about 200 psi right away due to cooling which is around 7% of the full tank. And he is a guy/not a girl An how would he explain an instant drop of the SAC from a week ago

Heck, after 10 dives, my SAC was so good. I went in the water with a 2800 psi short fill. After an hour, I had to surface because I had boosted the pressure up to 3200 psi. :grinjester:

I also had enough hot air left over to fly the balloon from Oz back to Kansas.

 

[elan]

He didn't do two dives though. And seriously if a someone who wants to be an instructor is struggling to get 100 dives, and does stuff like this, they really should get more experience.

I don't get why people who want to be instructors can't wait just a bit longer and do some more dives, especially given they want to make a career out of diving! It makes no sense and generally results in poor instructors given their lack of experience.

I know I know , tell me more But we do not discount this guy as he set a goal and he is not behaving like a jerk, he tells us straight out that there are a lot of things he does not know and he is trying to learn all the useful techniques. So it give us hope he will be a good instructor eventually. At least he is adequate evaluating his skill level.

 

[elan]

Heck, after 10 dives, my SAC was so good. I went in the water with a 2800 psi short fill. After an hour, I had to surface because I had boosted the pressure up to 3200 psi. :grinjester:

I also had enough hot air left over to fly the balloon from Oz back to Kansas.

Can you give me the address of your dealer , pardon, the guy who fills your tanks

 

[Lead_carrier]

Can you give me the address of your dealer , pardon, the guy who fills your tanks

Lefty's Tobacco JOINT
I know it was off subject but I couldn't resist.

To the OP's orginal question. Regardless of what the standards say, doing a 20ft/20 min dive, surfacing then doing another 20/20 dive is horse manure to me. If your dive numbers increase because of that fine, but I'd count the number of dives that were actually meaningful toward the DM course. Let your concience be the guide, but no pool or bathtub dives.

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

They're encouraged to log every sub-surface adventure but know that I heavily discount pool and quarry dives when it comes to evaluating their experience. Is 20 minutes in the pool practicing your hover worth 20 minutes at the quarry dodging bluegills? Possibly. In the long run, however, neither holds a candle to an honest to goodness open water dive.

What about a quarry isn't open water? Why is it any different from a lake?

 

[SDAnderson]

What about a quarry isn't open water? Why is it any different from a lake?

Ever been on a quarry big enough to hold a 700 foot shipwreck, let alone wild enough to sink one?


We train in the quarry because its safe and predictable, not because it's fun and exciting.
We dive in the lake because it's fun and exciting, not because it's safe and predictable. :shocked2:

The Grand Haven Lighthouse on the shores of Lake Michigan.

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

Ever been on a quarry big enough to hold a 700 foot shipwreck, let alone wild enough to sink one?


We train in the quarry because its safe and predictable, not because it's fun and exciting.
We dive in the lake because it's fun and exciting, not because it's safe and predictable. :shocked2:

The Grand Haven Lighthouse on the shores of Lake Michigan.

Why does a quarry have to be big enough to hold or sink a 700 foot ship to be considered open water? Would you not consider a clear and protected lagoon an open water situation? It is connected to the ocean but will not hold a 700 foot shipwreck or be wild enough to sink one. It is subjected to weather and temperature changes (as is a quarry).

Not everywhere in the ocean does it get as wild as the picture you posted but that doesn't mean they aren't open water situations.

 

[SDAnderson]

Why does a quarry have to be big enough to hold or sink a 700 foot ship to be considered open water? Would you not consider a clear and protected lagoon an open water situation? It is connected to the ocean but will not hold a 700 foot shipwreck or be wild enough to sink one. It is subjected to weather and temperature changes (as is a quarry).

Not everywhere in the ocean does it get as wild as the picture you posted but that doesn't mean they aren't open water situations.

Look, there's nothing immoral or indecent about diving in a quarry. They're excellent for training in. Some people actually have fun in the things. I'll stick by my original premise, however: quarries are a poor substitute for diving in the wild and divers, especially those who consider themselves to be serious about diving or want to become professionals, should have a broader range of experience than they can possibly obtain from the local mudhole.

 

[elan]

Ice overhead in a quarry can kill you with the same success as the waves in the lake. I think you just compare you local quarry to the local lake.