Whale Wars

[Capt.JimDavis]

This has been done for years. It doesn't work. People that don't want to support direct intervention against whaling, dolphin killing, shark finning, cyanide fishing of reefs, etc. should acknowledge the fact that when they say they are against these things that their opposition is limited to what leaves them feeling comfortable. Comfortable and ineffective. As Edward Abbey said, "If the end doesn't justify the means, what does?"
Paul Watson has many flaws (as I know very well as I spent a year researching Sea Shepherd and Greenpeace for the book), but he's out there and he does have some effect, not what's ultimately needed for sure, but more than has been done from years of hand-wringing protests by armchair environmentalists. It's easy to criticize, not so easy to do something.

I wonder what effect Paul Watson have or had? (Except another useless reality TV show)
Does whaling slowed down because of him?
Does other countries stop considering whaling?
Does whaling industry took a big financial hit because of his efforts?

When creatures get bigger and cuter killing them looks more horrifying to us humans. We teach our kids to enjoy and laugh and praise them when they catch a fish and see that fish jumping all over in order to throw the hook out of their mouth and go back in to the water.

But when a huge swordfish harpooned and it takes 2 hrs for them to die with gallons of blood pouring out of their body same parents go " awwww what a tragedy".

I know it's easy to criticize but it's MUCH EASIER TO DO SOMETHING as long as someone else paying for your cause.

 

[luckydays]

And Norway has been doing it for years. One of the main problems with the whole "whaling or not whaling" discussion is that people assume that all whales are endangered, which is not correct.

So you are saying that the discussions on to whale or now should wait until the whales are endangered. That seems a little late to have the discussion.

 

[drdiver1952]

And Norway has been doing it for years. One of the main problems with the whole "whaling or not whaling" discussion is that people assume that all whales are endangered, which is not correct.

This is very true. The Minke's that the Japanese take is a healthy stable population. Most people opposed to whaling are opposed not because of a threat of extinction, but that marine mammals should be protected period. My issue with the Japanese whaling is that it is the thin edge of the wedge so to speak. Large scale commercial whaling ended not because people decided whales needed to be protected, but because 1)the easily caught, most economical-read biggest-whales were gone 2)competitor products to whale oil were cheaper (for example whale oil used to be used for margarine--replaced by corn oil; meat and offal from large scale livestock operations replaced its use in pet food). It will come back because markets will develop for whale meat and blubber again as energy costs rise and the costs of those competitive products rise. The Japanese also advance the argument that the real problem with whales is that they feed on the krill that the Japanese harvest for commercial use and are thus competitors for a resource and need to be eliminated. I'm not optimistic about the future of whales at all.

 

[luckydays]

I wonder what effect Paul Watson have or had? (Except another useless reality TV show)
Does whaling slowed down because of him?
Does other countries stop considering whaling?
Does whaling industry took a big financial hit because of his efforts?

I am not sure what affect the Sea Shepard or Paul Watson had on the industry but it is my understand that Japan failed to reach its quota for whales for the past three years. If that has been because of Paul Watson and his organization, good for them.

I have never seen any sort of outcome of the supposed research from whales.

As for other fish/mammals/animals that are killed and/or slaughtered, if there is a moratorium on hunting and killing, then the hunting and killing should be stopped. The IWC has a moratorium on whaling since the mid 90's and has been extended until the current date. To bad they also have exceptions which allow the hunting and killing of the whales under the guise of "research"

 

[Tigerman]

So you are saying that the discussions on to whale or now should wait until the whales are endangered. That seems a little late to have the discussion.

Yes! Thats exactly what im saying, cause Im the moron you try to make me!
Or maybe not.
What Im saying is that theres no reason not to handle whaling as any other hunting/harvesting as long as the creature at hand is not endangered.

..
I have never seen any sort of outcome of the supposed research from whales.

As for other fish/mammals/animals that are killed and/or slaughtered, if there is a moratorium on hunting and killing, then the hunting and killing should be stopped. The IWC has a moratorium on whaling since the mid 90's and has been extended until the current date. To bad they also have exceptions which allow the hunting and killing of the whales under the guise of "research"

The japanese "research" is probably just an excuse anyhow.
Norway does the whaling openly and commercially, however we only hunt non-endangered speciec. We also never signed mentioned agreement and as such is not bound by it.

 

[drdiver1952]

I wonder what effect Paul Watson have or had? (Except another useless reality TV show)
Does whaling slowed down because of him?
Does other countries stop considering whaling?
Does whaling industry took a big financial hit because of his efforts?

When creatures get bigger and cuter killing them looks more horrifying to us humans. We teach our kids to enjoy and laugh and praise them when they catch a fish and see that fish jumping all over in order to throw the hook out of their mouth and go back in to the water.

But when a huge swordfish harpooned and it takes 2 hrs for them to die with gallons of blood pouring out of their body same parents go " awwww what a tragedy".

I know it's easy to criticize but it's MUCH EASIER TO DO SOMETHING as long as someone else paying for your cause.

"Whale Wars" has had an effect in increasing the number of people who know about whaling (a lot of people think it stopped with Moby Dick). I also believe that donations to Sea Shepherd are up, but I don't have numbers on that.

Last year, the Japanese cut short their season due to Sea Shepherd's harassment. Fewer whales were taken. That's a positive effect. The economics of Japanese whaling is murky at best--it's hard to get good numbers on whether it is profitable or not as it done as a "research" activity funded in part by the Japanese government.

As I pointed out in other posts, whaling is on the increase-Iceland has started doing it again. Norway never stopped. The Russians are thinking about it. The only whaling operations impacted were those where Sea Shepherd protested.

Most causes are funded by donations of one kind or another. Watson spends a lot of his time on fundraising. He's not independently wealthy (like Bwana Doc LOL).

 

[drdiver1952]

Yes! Thats exactly what im saying, cause Im the moron you try to make me!
Or maybe not.
What Im saying is that theres no reason not to handle whaling as any other hunting/harvesting as long as the creature at hand is not endangered.

This is a valid viewpoint. I don't hold it because I believe that whales are intelligent sentient beings that may have intelligence as developed as our own. I wouldn't eat chimpanzee or orangutan either based on those standards.

 

[luckydays]

Yes! Thats exactly what im saying, cause Im the moron you try to make me!
Or maybe not.
What Im saying is that theres no reason not to handle whaling as any other hunting/harvesting as long as the creature at hand is not endangered.

I am not trying to make you out to be a moron. And I never said otherwise.

I do think that if the organization to which a company is a member of (Japan and Norway - since you point it out) have a moratorium whaling, then that moratorium should be abide by - by all of the members. Or show what sort of research is being done on the whales that could not be done in a more human way. As other countries have shown. Australia for one, does not kill all of the whales that it researches, and they state that they are researching much of the same issues that Japan claims to be researching.

 

[luckydays]

The japanese "research" is probably just an excuse anyhow.
Norway does the whaling openly and commercially, however we only hunt non-endangered speciec. We also never signed mentioned agreement and as such is not bound by it.

Norway has been a member of the IWC since 1948

 

[Tigerman]

Norway has been a member of the IWC since 1948

So what? We never signed the no-whaling agreement and were not bound by it. Like it or not.