Titan LX Supreme vs. Enviro Sealed Atomic Z2

[krame]

I figured I'd add to the Reg A vs Red B thread list.

I'm looking at either a Titan LX Supreme or a sealed Atomic Z2.

Both end up costing almost the same. When broken down, the Atomic will cost $15 more a year to own.

AquaLung has the free octo program going on now, which is nice.

How does the Z2 breath at depth? Any better than the LX?

 

[Diver0001]

The problem with questions like this is that everyone will recommend what they own and maybe criticize what they don't own.

That said, I can give you an idea of the Titan LX. All of the the Aqualung regulators with balanced 2nd stages breathe very well at depth. The Titan LX doesn't have a cracking adjustment but in my experience (I've made a LOT of dives with all kinds of aqualung regulators that dated back to the 1970's) the balanced 2nd stages work so well that the cracking adjustment is something you seldom, if ever, need to use.

Even the lowly Calypso breathes just fine at the depths I use it (to about 20m because it's on a stage bottle).

If I compare that to the Sherwood regulators with unbalanced 2nd stages like the Maximus, which is the only other regulator I have 100 dives or more with, then the Maximus breathes like a clogged garden hose at depth as compared to the Titan unless you adjust the cracking on every dive. If you don't mind tweaking gear during the dive then the Maximus is fine, but for someone like me I thought it sucked dirty sport socks aside from the fact that Sherwood makes absolutely bullet proof 1st stages, which is a comforting thought. I eventually sold it and bought a Titan to replace it.

Full disclosure, I've owned 7 regulators, 6 of which have been aqualungs and unless they make some massive mistake I'll never buy another brand of regulator again... and that's from someone who isn't generally "brand oriented".

Having said that... and I hope some Atomic fans will check in, I've never used an atomic regulator but I've *literally* in 30 years of diving, never heard anything bad about them. The only incident I can ever remember hearing involving an Atomic regulator had to do with a "titanium" model catching fire on a 100% O2 stage. I'm 99% sure it was an atomic reg but not 100% sure.

Titanium and regulators is bad. If the model you're thinking of buying is Titanium then there would, in my mind, be a concern about using it with Nitrox mixes >40%. If it's not one of their Nitrox ones then I have the impression (as someone, once again, who has never used them) that they're probably perfectly good regulators.

That probably doesn't help you at all, but there you go

R..

 

[Dr. Lecter]

I could talk about the plusses of Atomic regs all day, but I honestly don't care what you buy so I'm going to save the effort. I will say you should try the mouthpiece on the AL out for a bit of you haven't already: the SP and AL mouthpieces and the bulky "reusable" clamps drive me nuts; others like them enough to put them on AA regs and leave me to swap them back out for AA mouthpieces when I buy their regs.

---------- Post added October 15th, 2013 at 10:26 AM ----------

The only incident I can ever remember hearing involving an Atomic regulator had to do with a "titanium" model catching fire on a 100% O2 stage. I'm 99% sure it was an atomic reg but not 100% sure.

Titanium and regulators is bad. If the model you're thinking of buying is Titanium then there would, in my mind, be a concern about using it with Nitrox mixes >40%. If it's not one of their Nitrox ones then I have the impression (as someone, once again, who has never used them) that they're probably perfectly good regulators.

Ti and regulators is pretty great; Ti and tech diving doesn't really mix. As a general rule, the Ti regs are much more O2 friendly now because of the upgraded design and increased use of monel components...though I still wouldn't stick a dirty Ti reg on an O2 bottle. All that's a non-issue as there's little Ti in a Z2, and I doubt the OP is going to be dealing with O2%s over 40% for quite some time, if ever.

 

[Diver0001]

Ti and regulators is pretty great;

For the OP's benefit. Titanium can spontaneously combust in an environment with a high enough PPR-O2 in the presence of a catalyst like certain types of oil.

I only know of a couple of cases of it happening to scuba regulators and in both cases they involved titanium regulators attached to 100% O2 sources (in one case a deco bottle and in one case a rebreather). There may be other cases but these are the ones I know about.

That said, it seems utterly daft to me to manufacture a regulator from titanium when you *know* that the innards of the 1st stage will be exposed to an environment well within the parameters that would allow for spontaneous combustion.

In other words, saying "Ti and regulators is pretty great" makes no sense whatsoever to me. IMHO Ti and regulators makes no sense at all given that there are perfect choices of metals that don't spontaneously catch fire within scuba regulator parameters.

R..

 

[1bubbleoff]

<----- another vote for the AL Titan LX....

I had the opportunity to try an Atomic Ti...breathes sweet..I agree...but not several hundred dollars worth sweeter. My Lx does fine thru rec depths..if its tuned correctly..it'll deliver all I need and more almost effortlessly. I admit..I'm prejudice toward my AL Titan Lx ...but only because imo..it's EARNED that status.
Easily tuned, field repairable, and parts availability is a no brainer anywhere you go. Whats NOT to love? I'd do it again in a heartbeat...

And The Lx and Supreme are VERY similar regs...

 

[fdog]

As you can see in this photo, I own both.

I have two stage regulators that are kind of "grandfathered", these are the Titan LX Supremes. Everything else, stages, backgas, etc, are Atomics.

The Titans have been durable enough - I still use them - but I can tell instantly when I switch between the Titan and the Atomic Z2. To my taste, the Z2 is easier breathing, and the inhalation characteristics are more pleasing.

In my humble opinion, the Z2 is one of the great values in regulators. It has the same parts as it's more expensive cousins, breathes the same, and costs half as much.


All the best, James

 

[Scared Silly]

Folks are drifting out to sea on the material choices. To the OP, both regs get good reviews from real divers in the tech side of diving. As such, I think the choice comes down to other features / options. Also I would not put much into the $15 more per year. Maintenance costs are quite variable.

When I was looking at regs for me it came down to the bulk of the second stage. The Atomic Aquatics design won out. Since then I have come to enjoy many other features but they are specific to my diving.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

For the OP's benefit. Titanium can spontaneously combust in an environment with a high enough PPR-O2 in the presence of a catalyst like certain types of oil.

I only know of a couple of cases of it happening to scuba regulators and in both cases they involved titanium regulators attached to 100% O2 sources (in one case a deco bottle and in one case a rebreather). There may be other cases but these are the ones I know about.

That said, it seems utterly daft to me to manufacture a regulator from titanium when you *know* that the innards of the 1st stage will be exposed to an environment well within the parameters that would allow for spontaneous combustion.

In other words, saying "Ti and regulators is pretty great" makes no sense whatsoever to me. IMHO Ti and regulators makes no sense at all given that there are perfect choices of metals that don't spontaneously catch fire within scuba regulator parameters.

R..

In what bizzaro world do you live that divers who don't know and understand the strengths and weaknesses of Ti as a reg material are routinely slapping uncleaned, unupdated Ti first stages on 100% O2 bottles?

I don't like Ti because of the fact that it's not O2 friendly, I *do* dive with mixes up to 100%, and I like not worrying about whether it's safe to take the reg off my back gas and put it on my O2 bottle if absolutely necessary due to an in-the-water emergency. I hate chromed brass because it's a ty metal for marine use, being a soft, easily deformed bi-metalic that's liable to flake/chip and corrode all too easily. The fact that it'll still last 20-30 years if properly cared for not withstanding, I like to split the difference with the beautiful ST1 first stages

That said, the vast majority of divers don't even use recreational nitrox, much less mixes above 40-50%. For them, the only question is whether the additional weight savings and corrosion resistance of Ti is worth its high pricetag.

 

[krame]

Thank you all for your responses! Just as I suspected, there isn't really a clearly defined winner. I asked around, and I actually get to dive an atomic Z2 this weekend, and since I already an own Titan LX, I hope the answer becomes clear around 75 ft.

I wish I knew, and hope to find out, just how much easier the Z2 is to breath than an LX

 

[Dr. Lecter]

Make sure you play with the cracking pressure adjustment knob on the Z2. I find that I like it closed most or all of the way on shallower dives, and half to most of the way open below 100' and/or with a heavier workload. Even on very deep air dives, where the density of the breathing gas is rather high, I don't like having it all the way open...the delivery of air is simply too much like having my lungs autoinflated for me rather than by me.