Tanks Rated Pressure ???

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Wow… really…


Same question apples to you my friend, do you have fabrication drawings and material specifications?

The answer to your question is yes, I have downloaded many of the Faber drawings from their web site. They are available to anyone that signs up in the site:
Scubadiving cylinders Faber leader in scuba diving cylinders Faber steel cylinders, diving, scuba, diving cylinders, diving cylinders, diving cylinders, scuba diving cylinders, sub SCUBA scuba DIVING

The drawings are divided under different codes (for different countries, including the US DOT and Transport Canada).

But more important is that you could have downloaded and read the CFR 49 and would have found out that many of your assumptions are incorrect. Material specifications are in the CFR.

The 2400 psi DOT cylinders are built and stamped under the 3AA code (as I mentioned above). In 49 CFR 178.37 you can see a table with the steel alloys authorized under the 3AA code. I am not familiar with three of those alloys, but substituting a higher strength alloy (like the ones used under special permits) is not an option.

The codes give the equations that can be used and the allowable stresses.

Faber makes many cylinders for many countries. You can download the drawings and take a look. You will see that they are different drawings for different codes.


About ten years ago the company I worked for manufactured high pressure cylinders for industrial gases. The cylinders I designed had to meet very strict codes because the service condition did not allow requalification every 5 years. The cylinders I worked on had to be designed with higher safety factors and allowances for degradation due to corrosion, etc. I am a Licensed Professional Engineer and I stamped the calculations and drawings for some of those cylinders.

Your assumptions about fabrication are also incorrect (Scared Silly is correct). I have not worked for one of the DOT cylinder manufacturer, but I have over two decades of experience in metal fabrication and pressure vessels.

DOT cylinders are designed to be light for transportation. They don’t even have allowance for material loss due to corrosion and that is one of the reasons they need regular requalification hydro testing and visual inspections. The assumption that they are over built is wrong. They are built with a safety factor to account for a number of conditions (this can be a lengthy subject).

All pressure vessels have to be designed with some safety factor. The pressure alone is not the only load that the cylinder has to survive. A DOT cylinder has to survive a reasonable vehicle accident (aircraft, over the road transportation, train, and marine).


At the end of the day I know you are going to believe whatever you like to believe. I realize that a government conspiracy is far more interesting than the boring facts.
So carry on. :rolleyes:
 
.....those damn defiant Faber tanks.
 
No there is not much talk about on this particular subject. Do a search on this board and you find this same discussion with the same results. It is all a myth that has been debunked.

Read this thread (note the date of the thread and the date of the original post some 6 years ago):

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/tanks-valves-bands/410067-overfilling-life-expectancy-lp-tanks.html

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ta...g-life-expectancy-lp-tanks-3.html#post6217847

My sources are Faber and their USA importer Blue Steel as well a few others such as Lee (aka Lead King) whom I have had direct communications. As said if you want real confirmation seek them out with your questions.

As for the mfg design, production, and QA again talk to the mfg. However, I can give you a good example. I just took a part a light module for a car. It comes in one outer case with the same electronics board but it gets configured 16 different ways just to save the cost on resistors and led modules that probably cost pennies. (i.e. the board is same but components on the board are different). Might seem silly but they certainly went through the cost analysis and I know cylinder mfg do the same.

Ok thanks, Ill read those over. i don't disagree that the manufacturing thing is not done, just think that it can be a likely hood some times.
 
Wow… really…




The answer to your question is yes, I have downloaded many of the Faber drawings from their web site. They are available to anyone that signs up in the site:
Scubadiving cylinders Faber leader in scuba diving cylinders Faber steel cylinders, diving, scuba, diving cylinders, diving cylinders, diving cylinders, scuba diving cylinders, sub SCUBA scuba DIVING

The drawings are divided under different codes (for different countries, including the US DOT and Transport Canada).

But more important is that you could have downloaded and read the CFR 49 and would have found out that many of your assumptions are incorrect. Material specifications are in the CFR.

The 2400 psi DOT cylinders are built and stamped under the 3AA code (as I mentioned above). In 49 CFR 178.37 you can see a table with the steel alloys authorized under the 3AA code. I am not familiar with three of those alloys, but substituting a higher strength alloy (like the ones used under special permits) is not an option.

The codes give the equations that can be used and the allowable stresses.

Faber makes many cylinders for many countries. You can download the drawings and take a look. You will see that they are different drawings for different codes.


About ten years ago the company I worked for manufactured high pressure cylinders for industrial gases. The cylinders I designed had to meet very strict codes because the service condition did not allow requalification every 5 years. The cylinders I worked on had to be designed with higher safety factors and allowances for degradation due to corrosion, etc. I am a Licensed Professional Engineer and I stamped the calculations and drawings for some of those cylinders.

Your assumptions about fabrication are also incorrect (Scared Silly is correct). I have not worked for one of the DOT cylinder manufacturer, but I have over two decades of experience in metal fabrication and pressure vessels.

DOT cylinders are designed to be light for transportation. They don’t even have allowance for material loss due to corrosion and that is one of the reasons they need regular requalification hydro testing and visual inspections. The assumption that they are over built is wrong. They are built with a safety factor to account for a number of conditions (this can be a lengthy subject).

All pressure vessels have to be designed with some safety factor. The pressure alone is not the only load that the cylinder has to survive. A DOT cylinder has to survive a reasonable vehicle accident (aircraft, over the road transportation, train, and marine).


At the end of the day I know you are going to believe whatever you like to believe. I realize that a government conspiracy is far more interesting than the boring facts.
So carry on. :rolleyes:

Well, your answer was pretty much what i was looking for, thanks. I have to say your right about me being able to to look for this info, but that takes up time and and frankly not very fun at all. Alot better to ask around and poke the info out of people by taking the apposing side in the argument. Makes a great scuba board thread if you ask me. :wink:

Anyway, pretty much what you wrote in that ^ post seem really convincing as well as informing. i have been trying to get into the drawings page in faber website for a day now but still haven't gotten a confirmation email. still wanna take a good glance at that. also just to double check this is the CFR your talking about right
49 CFR 178.37 - Specification 3AA and 3AAX seamless steel cylinders.

Thanks Luis
 
Alot better to ask around and poke the info out of people by taking the apposing side in the argument. Makes a great scuba board thread if you ask me. :wink:

So you admit being a troll. Nice!
 
I will need someone else to perhaps further explain this. The US has what is called a safety factor. It is 4..... so a tank that has a burt psi of say 10k will be assigned a working presure of 10k /4 or 2500 psi. Other countrys use less than a factor of 4.

Next the european tanks as i understand is made of a different material (stronger) so they have a higher burst rating.

As far as the 2400 /2640 goes this is from the goverment in WWII they demanded tanks that had woring presures that were higher than what you could get on th shelf. Instead of going through a redesign of vessels they permitted existing tanks to be allowed to use a working presure 10% above the rated presure. The 10% over fill was ok'd so long as hydro was good.

Now from the 60's i think that somewhere or other i heard that tanks could be hydroed once and that was it. perhaps once to retain the + on the hydro and then no more + rating.

Im sure this should stir some up.



Does not really answer my question, Im asking why 2 identical tanks can get different ratings depending on the country, the U.S. Being more strict about it then over seas.
 

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