Switch to BP/W. Need advice for building BP/W rigs

[Christian.Juanda]

Hello Fellow Gurus

I need advice on building bp/w rigs. My budget is around $500-600 max. I will dive mostly in tropical water (I stay in indonesia). My wish are :
1. Can accomodates for non ditchable weight on my back. I keep my weightbelt light
2. Easy to dump the air inside wings when in horizontal position.
3. Have 2 tankbands
4. Can accomodate twin tanks. In case I am do tech dive in the future

Also i have a question. Do the wings are created equal in terms of performance underwater?. Example: Donut wing from IST is very similar with Halcyon. So the performance should be par between those two. Am I right?

How to choose the backplate. Is there various size of the backplates? Should I choose Alu BP or SS BP?
I am fat guy with 175cm and 102 kg. I dive with 4element thermocline.

Regards
Christian

 

[Dive Right In Scuba 2]

I would definitely go SS on the backplate, that would give you 5-6 lbs of non ditchable weight. If you require more, a V weight pouch can be added for up to 7 more lbs. Depending on the back plate you get a single tank adapter may or may not be required. Most prefer one because it makes the switch from single tanks to doubles a little simpler. As far as wings go, its not a one size fits all thing. You'll want a wing for single tank diving and another for double tanks. Most wings at the basic level perform similarly underwater, some prefer a tougher shell, particular dump locations, inflation valve type etc. That's the amazing thing about a BPW set up, it's modular in nature so you can change things out to accommodate a rather large range of diving conditions and requirements.

 

[TSandM]

There is no wing that works well for single and double tanks. Doubles require a wing with a broad center panel, so that the air bladder lies outside the tanks. Putting that arrangement on a single tank rig causes those air bladders to "taco" up around the tank, and be very difficult to vent. The same plate can be used, but you will need two wings if you intend to dive single tank and doubles.

According to your profile, you are a brand new diver. You might want to rethink your decision not to have any ditchable weight. You won't need it at depth, of course, but if you end up on the surface in any kind of distress, having ditchable weight permits you or your rescuer to render you non-negotiably positive, which is a good thing. There are quite a few of us who dive without ditchable weight, but we have hundreds or thousands of dives, and are pretty sure how we will react under stress.

Since you are diving in Indonesia, in very warm water, it wouldn't be a big deal to buy an aluminum or Kydex plate. You will need a little weight on a belt with a single aluminum tank, and maybe one or two weights on your cambands. (I use 8 pounds with a 3 mil suit and an Al80.). A light plate will work very well with Al80 doubles, which are just about neutral. I use a 7 lb tailweight when diving that setup in warm water, with a dry suit and thin undergarment. With a wetsuit, you could use less.

 

[Mr Carcharodon]

An aluminum plate will give more flexibility in working out your weighting in warm water than steel. I recommend having some weight to dump but it does not need to be more than 4-6 pounds. With very minimal exposure protection and a steel plate you might not have 4 pounds available to dump. If you go to doubles you will end up with a second wing. In warm water 20-30 pounds of lift is plenty. A lot of the manufacturers will push big wings. But more lift than you need is not better. Bigger wings will have more drag, swim worse and be harder to dump. I use the dump on the low pressure inflator at the start of the dive and the dump valve on the lower left 99% of the time during a dive. There is no need for more than two dump valves. Try a simple harness first. Most people prefer those to “deluxe harnesses” which will require more ballast to sink. If you have mobility issues in your joints you might want a harness with a couple quick releases but try a simple harness first.

It has been almost ten years since I bought most of this gear so I will not offer brand recommendations. But after 10 years only thing that has been replaced is one low pressure inflator valve. I also added an aluminum plate to supplement my steel plate. Good gear it will last a long time.

 

[Christian.Juanda]

Hi All

Thank you for your valuable suggestions.
I understand if dive with single and twin tanks require different wings.
What I mean "can accommodate twin tanks" above is on the BP itself. So I just only change the wing to accommodate the twin tanks.
So, if a BP needs a single tank adapter to accommodate single tank dive, that BP can accommodate twin tanks, by removing the STA? correct me if I wrong.

@TSandM :
Yes, I am a brand new diver. maybe my first wish cause misunderstanding. Actually, I am not confident enough do open water diving with non ditch able weight (unless in a pool). So will still need the ditch able weight in the belt. But i think, limiting it to 4 -6 lb like Mr. Carcharodon's advice is good idea.
In my current BCD, there are a pocket in the bladder, so i can put some weight there. Not sure how to do this in a BP. I feel placing weight in the weight in the tank straps is not quite safe, but it just my personal preference.

@Mr. Carcharodon
Surely I will try your suggestion limiting ditchable weight to 4-6 lbs, the rig is complete. Also I will get simple harness, no failure points (I want to comply with DIR)
Btw do you dump the air in horizontal position? or you still need to positioning your body in such a way so the air can get out from the bladder? right now I need to positioning my body to a rather vertical position to dump the air. There are 3 valves, usually i use valves in left (inflator) or right valve, third one is on below right, but the air is hardly out from there no matter i tried :-(.

@Dive Right In Scuba
Thanks for your suggestion, A SS plate might be too heavy for me.

Regards
Christian

 

[tbone1004]

how much lead are you using now? That will determine if a SS plate is too much for you.
Not sure how shipping to Indonesia works from the US, but Aaron was too shy and didn't like the badass deal he has going on right now.
DRIS Dive Gear 28lb BP/W System | Dive Right In Scuba - Plainfield, IL - Dive Right in Scuba
It will get a little better at the end of November, but it's pretty slick right now, and even at full price, no other rig can tough it for the money.

If you are diving currently with more than 10lbs of lead, the SS will not be too much for you. You might only have a few lbs of ditchable weight, but that's all you need.

You're relatively normal height wise, so standard backplate sizes will be fine. It only really matters if you are sub 155/160cm or above 190cm.

 

[Christian.Juanda]

how much lead are you using now? That will determine if a SS plate is too much for you.
Not sure how shipping to Indonesia works from the US, but Aaron was too shy and didn't like the badass deal he has going on right now.
DRIS Dive Gear 28lb BP/W System | Dive Right In Scuba - Plainfield, IL - Dive Right in Scuba
It will get a little better at the end of November, but it's pretty slick right now, and even at full price, no other rig can tough it for the money.

If you are diving currently with more than 10lbs of lead, the SS will not be too much for you. You might only have a few lbs of ditchable weight, but that's all you need.

You're relatively normal height wise, so standard backplate sizes will be fine. It only really matters if you are sub 155/160cm or above 190cm.

Hi tbone1004

I usually use 5 kg lead in saltwater, although i also can sink with 4kg lead, the extra 1 kg is to counter the positive buoyancy from tank. (here we use aluminum tank).

Regards
Christian

 

[dumpsterDiver]

There is no wing that works well for single and double tanks. Doubles require a wing with a broad center panel, so that the air bladder lies outside the tanks. Putting that arrangement on a single tank rig causes those air bladders to "taco" up around the tank, and be very difficult to vent. The same plate can be used, but you will need two wings if you intend to dive single tank and doubles.

According to your profile, you are a brand new diver. You might want to rethink your decision not to have any ditchable weight. You won't need it at depth, of course, but if you end up on the surface in any kind of distress, having ditchable weight permits you or your rescuer to render you non-negotiably positive, which is a good thing. There are quite a few of us who dive without ditchable weight, but we have hundreds or thousands of dives, and are pretty sure how we will react under stress.

Since you are diving in Indonesia, in very warm water, it wouldn't be a big deal to buy an aluminum or Kydex plate. You will need a little weight on a belt with a single aluminum tank, and maybe one or two weights on your cambands. (I use 8 pounds with a 3 mil suit and an Al80.). A light plate will work very well with Al80 doubles, which are just about neutral. I use a 7 lb tailweight when diving that setup in warm water, with a dry suit and thin undergarment. With a wetsuit, you could use less.

Agree with about everything. If you are diving in the tropics, is it likely that you might want to freedive during a trip? Since you are a self described: "fat guy", you may want/need some lead to snorkel/freedive. If so you may well want to wear some amount of lead (i,e,, a weight belt) for that.

Possibly something on the order of 3 to 8 lbs for snorkeling, depending on exposure protection. I prefer to configure my scuba gear so that i can use the same weight belt for scuba and freediving. It gives me maximum flexibility to do both activities without changing something around and having some ditchable lead when scuba diving is, in general, a good idea.

 

[tbone1004]

you need 2kg to counter the AL80 tanks btw....

5kg is right where the rig will sit with a SS backplate. You won't have much ditchable weight, but that is a personal preference to whether you feel like you really need it or not. That becomes a personal preference. I'd go with the SS plate, but that's just me. I hate having to deal with a weight belt or any form of ditchable weight

 

[Centrals]

A SS plate(~3kg) + 2kg of ditchable weight on a belt.
Keep it simple.