Swimming vs. Snorkling in OW Course

[String]

Could you provide a cite for that? I'm curious about what regulation is in place in all of europe... I understand that a law would supercede a PADI requirement, but am not familiar with laws that would affect an entire continent.

thanks,
kari

If you're padi and have access to the padi members site theres a document and powerpoint on there in the resources called "Teaching in the EN affiliated countries".

Its all in there.

Swim not snorkel.

The swim and tread must be performed before any open water training is conducted and so on.

 

[Karibelle]

That was my point. It will weed out those who can't swim. It is not going to teach them anything new.

Okay, but to me there's a difference between "comfortable in the water" and "good swimmer." I couldn't really swim worth anything until about four months before I became a DMT, and then only because the swim was going to be timed.

Anyone who can't swim should not be in a scuba class.

Maybe you can better define "can't swim." Would a good solid dogpaddle work? How about the ability to float indefinitely on one's back, and flap the hands a bit every now and then? I certainly find it easier to teach some things to a swimmer (fin kick efficiency, for example) but I'm not clear on the direct link between swimming and scuba. Comfort in the water, ability to control the desire to panic, sure. But you're going to have to help me with swimming.

kari

 

[Karibelle]

If you're padi and have access to the padi members site theres a document and powerpoint on there in the resources called "Teaching in the EN affiliated countries".

Its all in there.

Swim not snorkel.

The swim and tread must be performed before any open water training is conducted and so on.

I am and I do, but I'm not able to find it on the site. Can you provide some more info?

So it's more accurately a difference in standards between Europe and the rest of the world? Is that the case? Any idea why there's the difference?

kari

 

[ekewaka]

–verb (used without object)
1. to move in water by movements of the limbs, fins, tail, etc.
2. to float on the surface of water or some other liquid.
3. to move, rest, or be suspended in air as if swimming in water.
4. to move, glide, or go smoothly over a surface.
5. to be immersed or steeped in or overflowing or flooded with a liquid: eyes swimming with tears.
6. to be dizzy or giddy; seem to whirl: My head began to swim.

I think #6 is the definition that PADI uses. I really don't know what their standards are.

 

[ekewaka]

I think the PADI standards are too low. 2000m would be better. That should eliminate those who only flap their hands or dog paddle.

 

[String]

I am and I do, but I'm not able to find it on the site. Can you provide some more info?

So it's more accurately a difference in standards between Europe and the rest of the world? Is that the case? Any idea why there's the difference?

kari

EN affiliated countries so basically all of europe.

As for the difference id assume they looked at the minimum standards/techniques of some of the entry level courses, decided they weren't enough so simply moved the height of the bar up slightly.

I'll dig out my laptop and find that reference for you and place it here in an edit when found.

Edit:- http://www.padimembers.com/Members/shared/StandardCEN/CenPil.htm

 

[Karibelle]

I think the PADI standards are too low. 2000m would be better. That should eliminate those who only flap their hands or dog paddle.

Why? As I say, I couldn't swim very well when I did my OW, but managed to live through 300 dives or so before becoming a good swimmer... am I just lucky?

kari

 

[klkconsulting]

I agree that anybody who wants to scuba dive needs to know how to swim, but I found snorkeling to be more challenging. I felt uncomfortable on snorkel when I became winded, and I had a tendency to try and inhale through my nose. Only continued practice on snorkel helped me get past those issues. So perhaps the better idea (as Thalassamania suggested) is to have students do both the swim and snorkel test. I see no negative to doing both.

 

[Karibelle]

As for the difference id assume they looked at the minimum standards/techniques of some of the entry level courses, decided they weren't enough so simply moved the height of the bar up slightly.

If that is the reason, then I wonder why they didn't make it across the board...

thanks for the link; very informative.

kari

 

[ekewaka]

E
As for the difference id assume they looked at the minimum standards/techniques of some of the entry level courses, decided they weren't enough so simply moved the height of the bar up slightly.

I think PADI raised their standards in Europe because the EU mandated it, and not because they decided it was too low.