Student with Buoyancy Problem

[got4boyz]

My 10 year old (almost 11) went for his first open water check out dive this afternoon. For some reason the instructor didn't do a weight check and just stuck 6 lbs. on a weight belt. After we swam out to the platform my son was having some trouble getting under, so the instructor basically pulled him down until he finally started sinking on his own.

Well once down on the platform trying to do his skills, he kept having to fight from floating up. It was tough but managed to get through all the skills until it came to the fin pivot. For some reason his feet kept floating up and once he was completely upside down!

The worst problem came when he removed his weight belt and tried to put it back on. He kept floating all over the place and whenever he tried to roll to get the belt behind him his feet would float back up and he'd be upside down again! He kept fighting this for 10 minutes or so before the instructor brought him up without him ever getting the weight belt back on. He was extremely frustrated to say the least, especially since he hadn't had any problems with the skill in the pool.

The difference tonight was that we was wearing a full wetsuit instead of a shorty and he was wearing booties, and the pool he wasn't.

So why would his feet keep floating up? And what can be done to compensate for that?

I must admit it was a pretty funny sight (poor kid). I laughed for the first time underwater. Have you ever tried to laugh while diving?

Anyway, any suggestions here would be most appreciated. The poor kid came home pretty frustrated. We are going back to the pool Friday night with the full wetsuit and booties to try and trim him out!

 

[DiveTub]

As soon as you are in the water do a weight check next to the platform.

With all the air out of the BCD you should float at eye level on a normal breath, when you exhale you should start to sink. If not then add a few more pounds and try again, make sure you have your reg in as you do this.

Sounds like you have a lazy instructor there !!

For the legs floating up. Try 1 or 2 pound ankle weights, they will help override the positive bouancy of the wetsuit and booties. They will make a huge difference and will gretley improve your sons bouyancy and diving enjoyment, you can purchase them at your LDS, or good sporting shops stock them as well.

 

[Walter]

My first recommendation would be to wait a couple of years then find a different instructor. If you're not prepared to do that, the advice you received from Chriso is excellent.

 

[MikeFerrara]

I hate to hear things tha make me mad first thing in the morning. Diving under or over weighted is dangerous. This instructor is dangerous. Get a new one before doing anything else.

Carefully eveluate wether or not you want your 10 year old diving. I dont have any hard rules about the age of the students I accept (beyond agency standards). But I will not certify a child who will be supervised by a parent who is a novice diver. Just to make the point, you should know how to address the weight and balance problem if you are to supervise him. For that mater, he should know how before certification and IMO before OW check out dives .

Your instructor has an open invitation to discuss safe teaching methods with me out behind my barn.

 

[got4boyz]

I really appreciate your comments and especially your concern. I would like to address some issues that were raised.

SydneyDiver, we had done the weight check as you described in the pool when he was wearing a 3 mm shortie and no booties. I don't know why the instructor didn't do it at the lake. Definitely a mistake!

I really appreciate the suggestion of ankle weights. The instructor suggested that also and said he would bring them to the pool on Friday to get my son weighted and balanced correctly. I wrote in to see if I would get similar suggestions since I had never seen this problem before. Is it common?

Walter and Mike, I've appreciated you straightforwardness in other posts and I do so here as well. I wasn't originally going to certify Race (the son in question). My oldest son Ryan asked to get certified for his 12th birthday in May so we decided to do it now so he could go on our dive trip to Panama City in October. Well Race begged and begged to get certified too, and Ryan wanted him to also so the four of us (my hubbie, myself and them) could go diving together.

I finally decided to let him try because in all honesty he was a much better snorkler than his older brother, and loved the water. In the pool sessions he did most of the skills better than Ryan did also.

The class was done in two weekends and it was too fast for Race. He didn't pass his quizzes at first so he wasn't able to do the open water checkout dives with Ryan. I felt given a little more time to study he could easily pass the tests and since he was better at diving, I figured he deserved another chance if he wanted to keep trying.

He insisted that he wanted to keep studying and get certified, so we studied hard for another week then went back and retook the quizzes. He scored 100% on all the quizzes, so we went ahead and took the final that same day, and he scored 94% on it!

At the lake yesterday after we came up from the dive where Race was unsuccessful getting the weight belt back on, we went in to shore and the instructor had him try again in about 4 feet of water. He kept having the buoyancy problem with his feet floating out from under him and floating, so after struggled for awhile I pulled him up and told the instructor this wasn't working and we needed to figure out what to do out the problem. That's when we decided to go to the pool with the full wetsuit and booties, and try ankle weights, etc.

Hopefully it will work out. If I have further concerns after our pool session I will find a new instructor!

I must give Race credit though for keeping his cool when he kept floating upside down and all around. I wouldn't have been so calm if it had been me!

Anyway, thanks again for all your suggestions. It is much appreciated!

 

[devilfish]

got4boyz once bubbled...
And what can be done to compensate for that?

Get a new Instructor!

 

[Cave Diver]

got4boyz once bubbled...
Hopefully it will work out. If I have further concerns after our pool session I will find a new instructor!

Talk about a small world... I was talking to a friend of mine who is an instructor at my LDS and after a few minutes of catching up I realized that he was the instructor in question in this post.

First of all, I would like to clear up a few things. It is my understanding that he is NOT the instructor that taught your son. Another instructor crammed the class into two weekends and was unable to finish with your son. Then at your request for a new instructor, the LDS asked this instructor to take over.

His first session with your son was at the lake and the weighting that was tried was based on the recommendation from the first instructor. Your son was basically given to him as a referral just needing to do his openwater checkouts. When he realized that this baseline was off, he removed some of his weight and added it to your son, but it was still insufficient to achieve neutral bouyancy.

After about 30 minutes he decided that due to the low visibility and the increasing chill it was better to end the session and go back to the pool so that he could work with your son in a controlled environment and get these issues worked out as he had never had a chance to do this himself.

If it turns out that we are indeed talking about the same instructor, and the stories seem to coincedentally close to assume otherwise, let me assure you of a few things.

I know the instructor that is currently working with your son personally. I just returned from a two week dive trip with him in the Cayman Islands, and I have dove with him on numerous other occassions. I have also assisted and observed in many of his classes as part of my DiveMaster training.

In my opinion, based on my knowledge and observations, he is a very good instructor. I believe that your son was the very first student of the original instructor. The current instructor was put in the rather uncomfortable position of finishing training of someone whom he had never met. To complicate that, the student is a child.

To your credit, when my friend was telling me this story, he said that you had done a very thorough job of helping your son understand all the information that had been thrown at him during the weekend cram sessions. He just feels that he needs to spend some time with your son in the pool first so that he can better evaluate where he is in regard to skills.

I'm not sure why he was put in open water, but the impression I got was when he was referred to the second instructor, the first instructor told him that was where he left off and that he was ready for it. Obviously, after getting there this proved to not be the case.

Depending on when the next water session (pool or lake) is scheduled I may be there. I am often around during his training sessions just because I use any excuse I can to get wet. If you would like any more information, feel free to contact me privately.

 

[jeffsterinsf]

got4boyz once bubbled...
...
He insisted that he wanted to keep studying and get certified, so we studied hard for another week then went back and retook the quizzes. He scored 100% on all the quizzes, so we went ahead and took the final that same day, and he scored 94% on it!
...

Clearly he understands the importance of what he is doing. While I freely admit not raising children myself, you seem to have one that can apply himself when needed. I think that as long as you continue to lead well, and make sure that he is not doing it as a "competition" and that he understands that the certification is just the beginning of the learning, not a wide-open ticket to do anything, anywhere, anytime, you'll be ok.

 

[got4boyz]

thanks for the encouraging words. Race worked and studied really hard for this. I'm very proud of him and have no doubt he'll be a great little diver!

 

[got4boyz]

John,

It is a small world (I started a post entitled that awhile back)! We are talking about the same guy, and that is how it happened. I didn’t explain the whole situation because I thought it would complicate the issue and not help it any!

You know I wrote this post looking for advice on the buoyancy problem, not to knock the instructor! Actually I was a bit surprised at the outcry it created and didn’t quite know how to respond to it. I really like the guy, and he really went out of his way to finish up with my son when the first instructor didn’t have the time after finishing with my oldest son. So true, he was put in an awkward position finishing up with Race, along with added pressure from me to get the certification done by the first weekend in October so Race could come with us on our dive trip to Florida.

The buoyancy problem came from the full length 5 mm suit that was worn to the lake. The instructor didn’t know it wasn’t the same suit he wore in the pool and he made a mistake by not doing a weight check. We all make mistakes. And it certainly wasn’t anybody's fault his legs kept floating up. Even if he had been properly weighted with a weight belt that would probably have occurred. I certainly never felt he was endangering my child, though I’ll admit that I was a bit perturbed that he let him struggle down there so long trying to get the weight belt back on. Maybe he was hoping he’d be able to get the skill done so we could move on. But I’ll reiterate again that I never felt he was endangering my child.

Anyway, I didn’t know how to react when I saw the posts berating this instructor. Part of me wanted to defend him, and part of me wondered if they were right! So I’m glad to know that you know and trust him John. (Another guy who knows him PMed me and agreed with you.)

Out at the lake was the first session in the water with Race. He had suggested going to the pool first but I told him as I'm sure the original instructor did, that Race had completed all his pool work satisfactorally and that wouldn't be necessary. I didn't want to waste any more of his time since he was doing this as a favor. And I honestly believe that had Race been in his shorty there wouldn't have been any problems doing the checkout dives at the lake!

Anyway, I’m sure everything will work out just fine. It’s just going to be a bit awkward now at the pool tomorrow! :embarr: (If he even shows up after all this! Seeing as you are his friend I'm sure you mentioned this little post! )