State Dept is Relaxing Parts of the Travel Warning for Playa Del Carmen

[Basscat]

I don't hold you responsible for my "personal ignorance" as you put it, however I will repeat my reasonable request for one source that substantiates your claim that the Cancun/Cozumel ferry bombing was an inside job by a guy who is in jail who was trying to perpetuate insurance fraud. You did "all that reading" before you headed to Cozumel so please, provide just one link since it's so easy to find.Even a local spanish paper that can be run through translation software that can easily find words such as "insurance fraud" and "guy in jail".

Otherwise you're just blowing smoke.

OK, we get it, you are afraid for your personal safety. Don't go.
I'm packing to leave the Island after a wonderful 10 days. Your loss.

 

[nodakdive]

I copied the following 4 paragraphs from a blog. Link to the full blog article is below the paragraphs.

"Since all of the incidents involve the same company, the investigation has focused heavily on Barcos Caribe and one of the owners, Roberto Borge Martín. He is the father of the former governor of Quintana Roo, Roberto Borge Angulo, who is currently incarcerated on charges of embezzlement.

There is quite a bit of speculation that the motive was insurance fraud since the family is having financial difficulties due to the pending criminal charges.

The insurance fraud hypothesis was bolstered by an article from news correspondent Raúl Rodríguez Cortés of El Universal on March 7th.

The reporter claims that there is a video in the hands of the investigators that shows Roberto Borge Martín boarding the ferry in Cozumel with an unknown man carrying a backpack. When the ferry arrived in Playa del Carmen, Roberto Borge Martín hurried off of the ferry and the unknown man was seen leaving without his backpack."

The above is from this link:

A Former Cop's Perspective on the Ferry Explosion in Playa del Carmen

The link to the Cortez article mentioned in the 3rd paragraph is below.

http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/colum...deo-que-probaria-un-auto-atentado-en-el-ferry

 

[The Chairman]

Otherwise you're just blowing smoke.

I don't smoke and never have, but thanks for the condescension. Hopefully, it will be the last I have to endure today. I found the articles very easily and so have others. You've chosen to be ignorant is all I can figure why you haven't. However, someone has done you a favor and gone back to find those links for you. Happy now?

Listen to the locals. They know better than any national news bent on increasing their ratings with turgid sensationalism. When I go diving, I listen to the weather report and especially the waves. However, if the captain tells me they have it wrong, 9 times out of 10, the captain is right. Sure, there are a few captains who will sugar coat things to get butts on their boat, but they are few and are easy to figure out. Listen to the locals. Listen to the people who visit frequently. They are the real experts for the area. Or continue to wallow in your ignorance and demean anyone with local knowledge who disagrees with you. It's your choice.

 

[ggunn]

Sure it's unsafe in many places but that doesn't mean I need to go out of my way and spend thousands of dollars to vacation in one of those places where cartel gangster gunman open fire on crowded tourist beaches and blow up ferrys.

Well then, for God's sake don't plan a trip to Las Vegas where gunmen open up on concert crowds and kill dozens of innocent people or Oklahoma City where mad bombers blow up buildings and kill or maim hundreds of people!

 

[The Chairman]

do you call them names too?

I actually tell my students when they are ignorant all the time. That's not the same as calling you an ignoramus or even stupid. I am ignorant of many things, some willfully, some by accident but mostly by default as there is so much information out there. Unless you claim to be all-seeing, you are indeed ignorant of many, many things. As am I. It's not a name. It's not an insult. It's a quality that affects your understanding of particular situations. Forums present a great way to relieve your ignorance of certain subjects. It's why we are so popular with the Google. Sorry, I offended you by pointing out the obvious. I kinda thought you knew already.

Why is there a need for Scuba Instruction? Because people are ignorant about how to dive safely. They usually come to the sport not even knowing what they don't know. If you want to get edumacated and all certified, you seek out an instructor who can relieve you of your ignorance about diving. Likewise, ifin you can't speak Spanish, don't get all huffy with those of us who can when we tell you what we've read. It appears you're more interested in justifying your decision instead of learning about the reality of the situation. Again, your ignorance is not my problem. I found the info pretty easily when I Googled it. You might find it takes you to our discussion about it. Wouldn't that be ironic? Moreover, when the topic came up in Coz and in Playa del Carmen, I got to hear from people who were there and knew the perp. I learned far more about this cretin than I wanted to. It's funny that you want me to cite all sorts of stuff, but the newscasts you cite give you very few particulars or any proof for their conclusions.

I have not read the articles in Spanish because I don't know Spanish,

You're repeating yourself. You don't need to defend your ignorance by citing further ignorance. We are all ignorant by default and we either make attempts to relive that ignorance on various subjects or not. That's your choice, but there's certainly no need to defend your ignorance as you seem to be doing. Personally, I love it when people correct my Spanish. This past week I learned several things and improved my overall competency. I am a little less ignorant about Spanish and am pretty proud of that. When the cabbie corrected my pronunciation of Quintana Roo to be "keentena row", I didn't ask him to give me a citation: I simply believed him and got him to help me instead. Rather than defending my Americanized destruction, er pronunciation of the name, I became a little less ignorant. Surprisingly, his knowledge of Spanish exceeded mine, so I deferred to his superior knowledge. Locals and frequent visitors will have a better understanding because they have a superior knowledge. Indeed, they are less ignorant and worth listening to. Citation or no citation.

BTW, why travel to a country and miss learning a bit about their language? I see it happen all the time, but I can't say I understand that mentality. When we went to the Philippines last year I tried to learn a bit of Tagalog. Oh, I failed more than succeeded, but it was cool to peek inside a bit. I can't wait to try my hand at Fijian! I'll probably never be fluent, but I'll learn what I can.

 

[Dogbowl]

@silex , you’re right. There’s no proof. You made the right decision to stay away.

Are we done now?

 

[The Chairman]

You say that, yet fail to provide your source.

I didn't fail. I just refused to do your work for you. Big difference.

 

[Charles2]

As I said earlier, I was planning a trip to Cozumel via Cancun which is the only realistic way for me to get there. I have put off the trip and pretty much written off going there any time soon if ever because of all the recent violence and concern for my safety.

@silex At great personal risk to myself, I will take your place. Please send all "paid-for" tickets, reservations, and interests to me. I promise to report back when I encounter any of your feared assaults, bombings, or outrageous acts of incivility. This is truly being done as a public service.​

 

[nodakdive]

I had already read the one article that is linked below by a @nodakdive, a helpful poster that does not call new members "ignorant". You're a scuba instructor? When a new student doesn't know something that is supposedly "common knowledge" do you call them names too?

I have not read the articles in Spanish because I don't know Spanish, and I am unable to translate those Spanish articles because when I try to run it through a translator I get (in effect) "Thank your interest but this material is copyrighted".

The one article that is written in English that refers to the supposed insurance fraud says nothing more than the following:

It doesn’t make sense that a criminal organization — whose ultimate goal is to make money — would plant a bomb in a popular tourist area. It would scare away their customers (i.e. the tourists) and bring a lot of additional police to the area.

What about Acupulco which went from a beautiful tourist paradise to a deserted war zone void of tourist because the drug cartels chased away all the tourists? That doesn't make sense either, but it happened. Apparently drug cartels don't always think long term.

There is quite a bit of speculation that the motive was insurance fraud since the family is having financial difficulties due to the pending criminal charges.

The key word being " a lot of speculation" that because the family has financial problems some guy blew up the ferry for insurance money. The guy that was IN JAIL at the time of the bombing. Speculation means lots of people are saying lots of things about what they think was the reason for the bombing with not one single shred of evidence. People come up with theories all the time. Check any accident thread on this forum and you'll see tons of theories most of which are wrong.

The insurance fraud hypothesis was bolstered by an article from news correspondent Raúl Rodríguez Cortés of El Universal on March 7th.

Ok here we have a direct reference to the one and only Spanish written article on this subject which @The Chairman says was "so easy to find".

The reporter claims that there is a video in the hands of the investigators that shows Roberto Borge Martín boarding the ferry in Cozumel with an unknown man carrying a backpack. When the ferry arrived in Playa del Carmen, Roberto Borge Martín hurried off of the ferry and the unknown man was seen leaving without his backpack.

Once again we have nothing more than a reporter "claiming that there is a video of a man carrying a backpack then not carrying a backpack". This has transformed into @The Chairman saying (I am paraphrasing) :"Everybody knows the guy who was in jail blew up the ferry for insurance money, it says so in the local papers which I read even though my Spanish isn't that good but I got the jist of it and anyone who doesn't blindly take it as fact is personally ignorant for not accepting that as the reason because you should believe everything the locals say because they know everything."

Silex, you may not have paid very close attention to what you read. It was the father of the guy in jail that was videotaped entering the ferry with another person carrying a backpack. When the ferry got to Playa, the father rushed away from the ferry and the guy with the backpack exited the ferry without his backpack.

In spite of what the article says, if someone that lives on the island, works on the island and has a business on the island said, "Nah. It's not about insurance fraud. It's about a shipment of Nikes that someone was trying to stop from getting to Playa." I'd be thinking "tennis shoes", not "insurance fraud".

Why? I've witnessed too many events where I know the truth and the truth doesn't match what is being reported. Surely, you've experienced the same.

A year or so ago, we had a real, national news doozey where I live. I work in the involved industry, live very close to the epicenter of the conflict, know many, many people involved in all aspects of the conflict and I know the whys and hows of what caused the situation. If my life depended on it, I couldn't provide a link for you that tells the real story, the truth. If I could, it would be like finding a needle in a haystack because the grand bulk of "articles" don't tell the real story.

Would I backpack through Jalisco with a load of money trying to make a heroin deal? No. Is that the same as flying into Cancun, hopping in a taxi to Playa del Carmen and taking the ferry (from Playa del Carmen, of course, because there is no ferry between Cancun and Cozumel) to Cozumel? Lol.

 

[Christi]

Bet these people didn't think they were in any danger when they went to work this morning. RIP and prayers to the victims families.

Five dead, others 'gravely injured' in shooting at Capital Gazette newspaper in Annapolis