Skin diving around divers on a safety stop

[Papa_Bear]

Please do not insult me. I haven't taken that stance with you. Furthermore, I do not make up stories. Especially involving ones where someone has died. I was in the hotel room with these children hours after they lost their mother. FYI the story can be found here: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/accidents-incidents/194157-over-weighting-death.html

Nothing in that story is how you told it! Her children 10 & 13 could have died with her if "She panicked" and the DM couldn't controller her! You wanted her children do rescue her? So thanks for posting the connection, but your stance leaves a lot to be desired and makes you look really wrong and people die all the time! So I don't see how that has anything to do with it? Ever been on scene of a TC?

 

[Missdirected]

Nothing in that story is how you told it! Her children 10 & 13 could have died with her if "She panicked" and the DM couldn't controller her! You wanted her children do rescue her? So thanks for posting the connection, but your stance leaves a lot to be desired and makes you look really wrong and people die all the time! So I don't see how that has anything to do with it? Ever been on scene of a TC?

Those were not the ages of her children. How I told it??? I didn't "tell it" - not even close and clearly you did not read it either :no I did tell D_B of something I will never forget that his comment brought to my mind. It was something you picked up on and inquired about so I gave u the link to the incident. FWIW, IMO, in that particular case, her children were not capable of assisting her/their loved one. Others well... Anyway, this is not the thread for the discussion of that event.

My stance is the same. There seem to be a few blowhards on this thread that would benefit greatly from a rescue class. As Thal said, people can be trained not to panic in an OOA and they can be trained on ways to assist other divers in need.

 

[Thalassamania]

Those were not the ages of her children. How I told it??? I didn't "tell it" - not even close and clearly you did not read it either :no I did tell D_B of something I will never forget that his comment brought to my mind. It was something you picked up on and inquired about so I gave u the link to the incident. FWIW, IMO, in that particular case, her children were not capable of assisting her/their loved one. Others well... Anyway, this is not the thread for the discussion of that event.

My stance is the same. There seem to be a few blowhards on this thread that would benefit greatly from a rescue class. As Thal said, people can be trained not to panic in an OOA and they can be trained on ways to assist other divers in need.

Don't quote me to PB, that's like a red flag in front of a bull. He doesn't believe that you can be trained to avoid panic, his favorite quote is "panic kills," and he has expressed an unwillingness to share air because he lacks confidence in his ability to survive and encounter with a diver who might panic.

 

[Missdirected]

I don't know that you can eradicate panic totally ineverysituation. However, you can raise that bar incredibly high and that alone is one hell of a benefit not only to yourself but the person whose life you may save (as opposed to knifing them or telling them to piss off).


I'll have to read that link later. Headed to a Bat Mitzvah now.

 

[String]

This is what we get for the poor level of training that is provided to most divers these days.
I can guarantee you that a diver can be trained to handle an OOA situation calmly and methodically ... even when the regulator fails at the end of an exhalation. Its just that the agencies do not see that as an important skill for a new diver. Go figure?

No doubt someone can be trained but in the real world i suspect the massive majority of divers you'll come across WILL panic at an OOA and try to snatch a reg or similar. Not really blaming the agencies - all of them teach OOA and all encourage people to practice skills. Some blame lies with the original instructor but most blame lies with the diver themselves for failing to bother practising those basic skills post-qualification.
The net result is when an OOA happens (which is normally another example of the diver doing something wrong) they normally panic at least until they get air.

 

[Thalassamania]

No doubt someone can be trained but in the real world i suspect the massive majority of divers you'll come across WILL panic at an OOA and try to snatch a reg or similar. Not really blaming the agencies - all of them teach OOA and all encourage people to practice skills. Some blame lies with the original instructor but most blame lies with the diver themselves for failing to bother practising those basic skills post-qualification.

I respectfully must disagree, all could be trained but few are. I feel that most of the blame lies with the agencies. In the old days we taught Buddy-Breathing, we taught it and drilled it to where new divers were perfectly comfortable with it and were perfectly comfortable to go out and practice it. When auxiliaries came along and the agencies mandated a switch, they started to cut down on the course time ... on the argument that axillary use was "mastered" so much faster than BB. And they cut time, and cut time, and cut time, to where today the average diver is shown how to use an axillary and ties it for a moment in the pool and o/w, but never really gets comfortable with it, surely not comfortable enough to practice it with a similarly skilled buddy. Just look at the fear that drips from many of the posts in any thread on the subject. Second I blame the instructor(s) who did not (does not) tell his or her agency to take a flying F. Lastly I blame the student for not seeking out qulified and competent instruction in the first place, but that can be hard to find.

The net result is when an OOA happens (which is normally another example of the diver doing something wrong) they normally panic at least until they get air.

Yep ... that's the net result you'd expect. Great system we have ... no?

 

[psychocabbage]

I dont think I could sit by and do nothing unless I knew it was with out a doubt going to kill me too.

You think any that dies driving down the street knows its their last drive? I highly doubt that you get that much information.. Its all a judgement call.

Just curious -- did you choose your user name, or did someone else suggest it for you?

Been my net name for many many years..

There are many ways to help a diver and get a situation under control. Knifing them or just telling them to piss off should not be the first thing that comes to mind.

One way is surely to let them stop breathing.. then they are not flailing about erraticly!
We all have different drives in life. I have taken CPR and other classes and still will not be the one using them on anyone. I took them because work/school or whatnot mandated I take them. No one can force me to use a skill. I speak fluent spanish yet will not use it at all. Why? No desire. We are all different people on this rock and not all of us have to adhere to a common way to thinking.

 

[caseybird]

We all have different drives in life. I have taken CPR and other classes and still will not be the one using them on anyone. I took them because work/school or whatnot mandated I take them. No one can force me to use a skill. I speak fluent spanish yet will not use it at all. Why? No desire. We are all different people on this rock and not all of us have to adhere to a common way to thinking.

Let's promise each other to never, ever dive together.

 

[psychocabbage]

Let's promise each other to never, ever dive together.

Thats just it! I dont ever dive with anyone but my family. I have 0 desire to go diving with any of you people.. ever.. I am not a diver for the social aspect.. Nor for the majestic views underwater.. When I get a seabob, I am sure diving will be what I want it to be! High speed fun! Man and machine!

 

[String]

I have taken CPR and other classes and still will not be the one using them on anyone.

So lets get this right, despite supposedly being trained in rescue skills that could save a life if someone was on the floor in front of you needing CPR/AV you'd refuse? Even if you were the only one there with any knowledge of it at all?

Im sensing a troll here.