Skill or Stupid Stunt

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yeah, he proably got scared when he saw what they were doing, and
over-reacted

it probably didn't ocurr to him until after he saw what they were doing
how things could be construed in case of an incident
 
You learn a lot about the liability side of diving in the DM, AI and Instructor classes that you have no clue about when you first start diving. A new leadership level diver is naturally going to be a little freaky about this stuff at first because basically if something goes wrong you can lose everything.

You didn't do anything wrong, that DM only knows how classes that he has been involved in are taught. Different instructors do different things and different agencies allow different activities. I am a NAUI instructor and we do stuff in our OW classes that the PADI instructors who teach the evening classes at the university are not allowed to do. Remove and replace gear is part of our OW class as is a "bail out" (with air turned on) which is an entry and descent while carrying your gear then you put it on at the bottom. We also do zero visibility exercises including shallow water air sharing because the chance of encountering zero vis in some of the local quarries is really good and our divers need to know they can function when they can't see. This training gives them enough information to exit a zero vis situation safely not to dive in one. We use aluminum foil over the masks to block their vision. I would be willing to bet your DM buddy has never done any zero vis training in a pool.

There are a lot of divers out there doing stuff during dives that they haven't been trained to do yet. How many people are taught how to go through a swim through? Probably not a lot but many dive destinations have them. The pool is the safest place to learn new stuff and make mistakes. Constantly breathing is the secret to safety in a pool, keep your airway open, always blow little bubbles when the reg isn't in your mouth, never ever hold your breath. Use your own gear too :)

Hopefully your DM buddy will get a chance to work with a variety of instructors so he can become familiar with different teaching styles and activities. It sounds like you respect his concern about liability and that's a good thing because it is a valid concern.

You can learn a lot from divers who have more experience and there is nothing wrong with doing that as long as you both keep safety in mind. Don't do anything you aren't comfortable with, make sure you communicate with your buddy before the dives as well as during the dives. It sounds like you both understood what the plan was even though you did not discuss it on the surface. This type of communication success underwater can serve you well in a situation that isn't going quite right or can just make a regular dive more enjoyable. You and your buddy seem to have "clicked" in the communication aspect and that's a really good thing.

Practicing skills with your buddy is a good idea, trying out new stuff in a safe environment is also a good idea, having a safety diver watching while your doing it is an even better idea.
Ber :lilbunny:
 
We did gear removal underwater in BOW last September - a couple of times... this was NAUI though not PADI if that makes a difference...

Tim
 
Many years ago, I was tought this "basic skill" in class using a dbl. hose reg. It was a skill you had to know before you got your c card. Good for you for taking the initiative to learn it in a controlled setting. And god forbid, tought yourself a skill that should have been tought to you already. I also had to learn tables, which, I was told its a "specialty" class now. Too much is left out in basic scuba these days let alone O.W. Im not sure if its fear of lawyers, or another way to seperate divers from their money by making everything another "specialty" class.
 
No big deal, that why the best place to practice new skill like swapping gear is in a pool. Your buddy is a new DM that why is was annoyed about it. I used to go to the local pool and practice some pretty weird stuff. Like breathing from a tank without a reg. Reading the date on a penny without a mask etc etc I gain a lot of experience from those crazy stunt.
 
You were in confined water during a practise session. Knock yourself out, your DM buddy over reacted. If he was so concerned, why wasn't he providing proper supervision where he would have politely stopped you before you swapped gear. You could have then discussed it and reconsidered your course of action.
 
Pez de Diablo:
You were in confined water during a practise session. Knock yourself out, your DM buddy over reacted. If he was so concerned, why wasn't he providing proper supervision where he would have politely stopped you before you swapped gear. You could have then discussed it and reconsidered your course of action.

I totally agree! The guy should have handled the situation better instead of treating you guys like a bunch of 4 year olds.
 
I feel I am an inexperienced diver as well, no matter how many people tell me my skills have improved or how natural I look. (I figure they'e calling me a whale or a manatee)
My friend Gibbon looks like a merman when he casually freedives for a minute or more to thirty feet. When I get in the water, I am constantly thinking of my skills. Then again I'm still paranoid of not having much practice even though I've been certed since 01.
I feel that you only become better by practice. My instructor had the luxury of only having myself and my dive buddy as students in our private class, so we had concentrated instruction. The skills I was absolutely terrified to do then, r&r/clearing of mask and breathing without a mask on, I can do somewhat comfortably now. I want as much practice time as I can get even if it's doing so in three feet of water in a pool. I just don't have that luxury. I also agree with Andy that as liability goes (and he should know) today's world is not as honorable as it used to be. Now, even if there is no liability, an unscrupulous person can create the liability and somebody else loses everything! As a rangemaster in Law Enforcement, I was responsible for the actions of anyone on the range, even if tey weren't in my area. You suddenly become VERY aware of ignorant (lack of knowledge/uneducated) people, and stupid(careless/reckelsss in the face of knowledge) people. There is not much worse on a range than to see a twelve year old son of an LEO wlaking arond on state propery shooting birds with a BB Gun.
There are so many different training agencies, and so much information, it is hard to say what is needed and not needed. That's why we have advanced classes. I don't feel I have a need to learn to exchange gear with a buddy. If something is that wrong, we need to surface. Also, with weight integration, when removing the bcd, people like me tend to pop up like a cork if not weighted down. My buoyancy needs are different from Gibbon's when we dive as well. These are all things to consider. In a pool, there is a false sense of security that develops as well. Ten feet deep in a pool has the same hazards as ten feet deep in a spring for the most part. I will personally inform my dive buddy of skills I will want to practice, either before I do them or before we dive. Dive slates are a wonderful thing. If a Dm invites peole to practice though, he immediately accepts the liability for the group and its actions. If everyone just "shows up to practice" there is an assumed liabilty if everyone knows he is a dm, or any of the divers are previous students. That's one of the hazards of being an instructor. He definitely should not be loaning his gear because it increases the potential. As for the actual practice of skills. I find it better to be alone with my dive buddy and nobody else around. It is more comfortable, and creates a better focus on what we're doing. Anywhere there is a "training" situation, even if it's a veteran diver giving tips to a noob, the liability is present. For me, teach me whatever you want to. Just teach me correctly, please! I would love to be able to dive every day in a class. Practice makes "second nature" not perfect. I applaud you guys for practicing skills at all. Many people drop out of diving for lackof wet time. rock on!
 
I did my OW in January this year, we completely removed all our gear, then put iit all back on in the first session (pool session) of the course. I don't see much difference between this and swaping gear, but then, I'm a newbie :) My course was with PADI.

Z...
 
I agree to practice, practice... Come on by and dive with me. I'll lend the equipment and practice with You!
Too many people are afraid to do anything without "Instruction" or being Sued for something...The way things are going now I'll be surprised that You will need "instruction" to walk across the beach, lest You fall from stepping on some kelp!
I encourage divers to work at skills to be comfortable in the water. You can read in books or watch a video to learn new skills. When You Practice in a pool what could be more safe? I would hesitate to say that You can "try" something new in a salt water current or on a reef of coral. A Pool is the safest place to try things out.
It would be nice to communicate before hand but as long as You both understand what is happening....enjoy! Bill
 

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