Scubapro MK17/C300 or Mk11/R195

[Raven007374]

Hi guys! i am new to diving and buying my first set of gear and i need help selecting my regulator. i am definately going to get scubapro becuase everyone i have met has said nothing but good things about them. I normally dive between 60-30ft in fresh water. temp is between 45-70 degrees (depending on thermocline and time of year). vis can range from 6-20ft. bottom can be murkey/silty. i do not plan on ice diving, but do plan on cave and wreck diving. i also plan on getting my advanced open water cert so i can dive to around 100ft. i also take a family vacation to the bahama's to snorkel/dive every year. i basically need a good all arounder and i am stuck deciding which regulator is right for me. I am thinking i need the MK17/C300 set up, but the MK11/R195 looks to be a solid all arounder. any thoughts on which one i should buy?

 

[beaverdivers]

Welcome to SCUBAboard! Both are excellent choices. If you are not going to ice dive, then the MK11 will be fine.

 

[axxel57]

@Raven007374

If you are diving in temperatures around 45', you might want to dive a sealed diaphragm 1st stage.

Unfortunately is the MK17 the only model which you can choose if you want this type of 1st stage from Scubapro.

In the thread http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/regulators/446262-most-desirable-scubapro-1st-stage.html I discussed why I think that the MK17 and the MK11 are substandard models in comparison with other diaphragm 1sts manufacturer.

Getting yourself the MK11 -R195 or MK17 would combine all disadvantages of a diaphragm 1st together with an unbalanced 2nd stage.

Since the IP difference between full tank and near empty tank is exceptional high ( SP itself expects an IP difference up to 12psi for the MK11-17 and unfortunately they are often even higher) you start with a not very easy breathing regulator (in comparison to other models), but when you are at your safety stop in the end of the dive your regulator will breath as smooth as it can.

If you are considering buying this model, I think you are better off with a MK2 -R195, it's cheaper,a good cold water regulator and it will breath up to its capacity in the beginning of the dive, and only in the end it might breath a little harder.

It would be a bit different if you would combine one of those model with a balanced 2nd stage like the G260 - G250 or the S600 and the A700.
The balancing of those second stage would it make not very probable that you actually can feel this design flaw of SP.

If on the other hand you would consider to choose the piston models like the MK25 - S600 - G250 - A700, you would dive some of the best regulators on the market.

 

[Raven007374]

What reg setup would you reccomend for me? i want to spend betweem $5-600ish. brand doesnt matter, i just want something i know i will get the best bang for the buck for and will work for my diving specs perfectly. thanks for the advice!

 

[tplyons]

On a dive boat here in NJ you will see two ScubaPro setups: MK17/S600 or MK25/S600. I dive the latter.

Some of us use a MK2 for our pony bottle, but seldom on our main tank, and more often than not, the ponies have MK17's or MK25's.

Take it for what its worth, but I don't recall the last time I saw a MK11 used anywhere but rental regs.

While they are good regs, there is better out there.

If I were to spend that much on a reg set, I'd spend another $200 to get one of the best.

 

[beaverdivers]

If you are diving in temperatures around 45', you might want to dive a sealed diaphragm 1st stage.

Unfortunately is the MK17 the only model which you can choose if you want this type of 1st stage from Scubapro.

The MK11 is a sealed diaphragm 1st stage. The diaphragm keeps water/dirt out of the main mechanism.

Since the IP difference between full tank and near empty tank is exceptional high ( SP itself expects an IP difference up to 12psi for the MK11-17 and unfortunately they are often even higher) you start with a not very easy breathing regulator (in comparison to other models), but when you are at your safety stop in the end of the dive your regulator will breath as smooth as it can.

If the IP is set correctly w/ the IP at 145 PSI @ a tank pressure of 500 PSI, then the IP @ a tank pressure 3000PSI would be no less than 133 PSI. I have found the IP diff. to be less than 12 PSI in almost all cases. IMO, this IP diff. is insignificant.

If you are considering buying this model, I think you are better off with a MK2 -R195, it's cheaper,a good cold water regulator and it will breath up to its capacity in the beginning of the dive, and only in the end it might breath a little harder.

I agree the MK2/R195 is an excellent reg., but the OP is diving in silty water so the MK11 might be a better choice.

It would be a bit different if you would combine one of those model with a balanced 2nd stage like the G260 - G250 or the S600 and the A700.

Yes, the MK11 seems to perform better w/ a high end 2nd stage due to the fact the expensive 2nd stage is out preforming the less expensive one.

If on the other hand you would consider to choose the piston models like the MK25 - S600 - G250 - A700, you would dive some of the best regulators on the market.

Agreed!

 

[elan]

You only need MK17 if you dive in subfreezing surface conditions as it will prevent ice forming on the main spring. Otherwise MK11 will work just fine. 45f is tropical water for most of those regs.
Personally I would take MK11 - A700 combo just for the sake of metal case of A700, if you have extra $ you can upgrade to MK17

 

[beaverdivers]

What reg setup would you reccomend for me? i want to spend betweem $5-600ish. brand doesnt matter, i just want something i know i will get the best bang for the buck for and will work for my diving specs perfectly. thanks for the advice!

I didn't realize your budget. The MK17/G260 is the ticket! It is only slightly more than going w/ the MK11/G260.

 

[Jon_R]

What reg setup would you reccomend for me? i want to spend betweem $5-600ish. brand doesnt matter, i just want something i know i will get the best bang for the buck for and will work for my diving specs perfectly. thanks for the advice!

Just Saw the mk25 s600 on amazon for 509 shipped.. I bought one new on eBay from Italian vendor for about 425 last month.. I have a few of them and they work good. Also have some atomic aquatics and they work good to but I don't do cold water diving.

 

[axxel57]

@beaverdiver

The MK11 is a sealed diaphragm 1st stage. The diaphragm keeps water/dirt out of the main mechanism.

Correct. That's nicely quoted from the Scubapro Webpage. Right, I forgot to write ' with a dry chamber'........

If the IP is set correctly w/ the IP at 145 PSI @ a tank pressure of 500 PSI, then the IP @ a tank pressure 3000PSI would be no less than 133 PSI. I have found the IP diff. to be less than 12 PSI in almost all cases. IMO, this IP diff. is insignificant.

Might be that for you an increased cracking effort of 0,3 -0,4 inch/water between near empty and full tank is insignificant, luckily enough for the divers all other manufacturers ( as far as I have seen) think differently and leave this discrepancy to their unbalanced models.

A MKII has usually when new, an IP difference of 14-16psi between full and near empty tank, which translates in higher cracking effort of about 0,3 - 0,5 inch/water.

I`m pretty sure that you don't really understand this correlation between IP differences and increasing-decreasing cracking effort, otherwise I guess you would be too embarrassed to write such a nonsense here in this forum.

On the other hand I have quite an idea of your enthusiasm when you explain, why it would be better for most of your customers to get themselves a 'balanced' MK11 - MK17.

I agree the MK2/R195 is an excellent reg., but the OP is diving in silty water so the MK11 might be a better choice.

Well, okay.......

Yes, the MK11 seems to perform better w/ a high end 2nd stage due to the fact the expensive 2nd stage is out preforming the less expensive one.

Okay, so the effects of the correlation between the IP differences and the cracking effort are felt less,because the high end 2nds are more expensive than the less expensive ones. So they are out performing the latter.

Whow, I'm pretty sure that with explanations like this you are impressing your clients deeply.

On the other hand shows me the way you are arguing these technical aspects of regulator technique, that you have hardly any real clue how these regulators are working you are selling and working on.

Problem is probably that the clinics of Scubapro and other manufacturers are very superficial ( at least all the ones I attended) and you might end up as a reasonable spare part changer, but not as a regulator technician as I see it.

A lot of members of this forum seem to be happy with the deals you can offer them, so keep on selling, good luck, but please stay out of technical discussions until at least in one thread you have proven that you understand the basics of regulator techniques.