Rental equipment quality

[iScream]

With an air integrated computer ones breathing rate is factored into the computers algorithms and improves calculations for air time remaining and bottom time.

Why would anyone recommend against that???

My wife and I use the air integrated Oceanic ProPlus. We've had them right at 14 years now or a little over 800 dives. Never a problem. Always trust it.

They do cost more but remember to add at least a $100 to the price of any non-integrated because you have to buy a seperate SPG.

That's a console computer, right? I think most people are recommending wrist strap computers and they are saying that the wireless integration can be flaky.

Hopefully I didn't butcher that. Mostly just trying to make sure I'm understanding what I've read in this thread and in the computer section of the forum. So please don't rip me if I missed something, but please do correct me.

Chris

 

[djanni]

That's a console computer, right? I think most people are recommending wrist strap computers and they are saying that the wireless integration can be flaky.

Hopefully I didn't butcher that. Mostly just trying to make sure I'm understanding what I've read in this thread and in the computer section of the forum. So please don't rip me if I missed something, but please do correct me.

Chris

Yes, the ProPlus is a console computer. The wireless models are quite popular though. Don't know about the flaky part. Ask someone that uses a wireless? Just like you shouldn't ask someone using a BPW if they like a jacket.

 

[mstevens]

Air integration overall is more complex than a dive computer that doesn't integrate air consumption.

Hoseless air-integrated computers that use wireless transmitters flake out (pretty frequently), and they're another part that can have an O-ring fail or battery run down. Unless you have a backup SPG, you also lose a way to know your remaining gas pressure if the transmitter or computer itself fails.

Console air-integrated computers are probably less likely to fail, but you still have the issue of no SPG if the computer floods or the battery dies.

In both cases, it can be problematic to travel with an air-integrated computer since you may not be able to mount your console or transmitter to rental gear. A hoseless computer will still work just fine in these cases, it just won't be able to track gas pressure and consumption.

Despite the concerns I listed, we use hoseless air-integrated computers. I personally like them. However, the recommendation for a good, basic wrist computer is sound. The Oceanic Veo model that many dive shops rent out is durable, simple, and a really good value.

 

[halocline]

With an air integrated computer ones breathing rate is factored into the computers algorithms and improves calculations for air time remaining and bottom time.

They do cost more but remember to add at least a $100 to the price of any non-integrated because you have to buy a seperate SPG.

If you are claiming that the diver's respiration affects how the computer calculates N2 loading, I don't believe that for a second. Maybe you could provide some proof. The mathematical models that calculate N2 loading are entirely dependent on time/depth data, and have nothing to do with respiration as far as I know.

I just spent $44 for a brass/glass SPG.

 

[djanni]

Humm... You might be right on the bottom time. I'll check that out.

Low price on an SPG.

If you are claiming that the diver's respiration affects how the computer calculates N2 loading, I don't believe that for a second. Maybe you could provide some proof. The mathematical models that calculate N2 loading are entirely dependent on time/depth data, and have nothing to do with respiration as far as I know.

I just spent $44 for a brass/glass SPG.

 

[MMM]

If you wear the heartrate monitor with the Galileo Sol, it does. SCUBAPRO - GALILEO SOL But it's the exception to the rule. And I barely ever bother wearing mine. This isn't exactly an entry level dive computer.

I DO love the air integration, but I also have an SPG AND a back-up, non-AI computer with the same algorithim as my main computer on every dive I do.

If you are claiming that the diver's respiration affects how the computer calculates N2 loading, I don't believe that for a second. Maybe you could provide some proof. The mathematical models that calculate N2 loading are entirely dependent on time/depth data, and have nothing to do with respiration as far as I know.

I just spent $44 for a brass/glass SPG.

 

[djanni]

I'm saying the divers breathing rate is used to calculate air time remaining and bottom time remaining. Google the ProPlus 2 manual and see for yourself.

Low price on an SPG.

If you are claiming that the diver's respiration affects how the computer calculates N2 loading, I don't believe that for a second. Maybe you could provide some proof. The mathematical models that calculate N2 loading are entirely dependent on time/depth data, and have nothing to do with respiration as far as I know.

I just spent $44 for a brass/glass SPG.

 

[mstevens]

I'm saying the divers breathing rate is used to calculate air time remaining

Sure, within pretty broad limits. It's not so much "calculate" as "estimate".

and bottom time remaining.

Not really. That's only true if air time is the limiting factor. If one has, say, unlimited gas, then bottom time is limited by either NDL or a deco plan. NDL is entirely dependent on time, pressure, and gas mix. It's tables, calculated on-the-fly and repeatedly.

You can easily prove this to yourself. Get two AI computers. Simultaneously dive with one connected to your gas source and the other disconnected. See if they show different NDL or deco parameters no matter how much you huff and puff or how daintily you sip air. They won't.

 

[ggunn]

I'm saying the divers breathing rate is used to calculate air time remaining

Sure, within pretty broad limits. It's not so much "calculate" as "estimate".



Not really. That's only true if air time is the limiting factor. If one has, say, unlimited gas, then bottom time is limited by either NDL or a deco plan. NDL is entirely dependent on time, pressure, and gas mix. It's tables, calculated on-the-fly and repeatedly.

You can easily prove this to yourself. Get two AI computers. Simultaneously dive with one connected to your gas source and the other disconnected. See if they show different NDL or deco parameters no matter how much you huff and puff or how daintily you sip air. They won't.

All that said, I am perfectly happy with my Oceanic wrist computer and a gas pressure gauge. Between the two of them I can figure out when I need to ascend.

 

[willmann_nc]

I have air integration on my Mares ICON HD and love it, along with the digital compass and ease of use. I know the SAC rate has nothing to do with the Deco algorithms in that computer. I also dive with a SPG and backup wrist computer in the event the air integration loses synchronization during the dive, which has never happened. I think most of the problems with the air integration units are due to not changing the battery in the transmitter.