Regulations for "pro" underwater photography?

[M_Bipartitus]

I was interested if anyone had experience with what laws apply to taking photos underwater with the intent to sell them. I have a few questions for discussion. I'm aware most paid diving seams to be covered by OSHA commercial diving rules, but I have never heard it discussed in relation to underwater photography. I'm aware that few people seam to worry about it, but I live in an area that is very litigious and I'd like to hear some thoughts on the topic.

1.) First do OSHA commercial diving rules apply? If I'm diving with my camera with the intention of selling photos, by most accounts I'm diving with businesses purposes thus being paid. Is this commercial diving as far as the law is concerned? I've read through OSHA rules and the only exemptions seem to be for scuba instructors teaching, scientific divers, government agencies and public safety divers. Many of the arguments for the exceptions granted for instructors would seem to apply to much of underwater photography, but I've seen no opinions on the topic. Moreover they may not apply if you are hired for some specific subject/ location.

2.) Does it mater if I'm diving for my own stock photo portfolio, or if I have a specific job commissioned by someone else?

3.) What about a paid assistant in the water? They are diving as an employee. What about a buddy that is not being paid, but is assumed to assist in the event of a problem?

P.S. I've also posted on wetpixel, so please don't complain if you see both. I know some people get picky about the same post on more than one forum. Not to mention, if you notice that it's on both you need to spend more time away form the computer.

 

[Thalassamania]

I was interested if anyone had experience with what laws apply to taking photos underwater with the intent to sell them. I have a few questions for discussion. I'm aware most paid diving seams to be covered by OSHA commercial diving rules, but I have never heard it discussed in relation to underwater photography. I'm aware that few people seam to worry about it, but I live in an area that is very litigious and I'd like to hear some thoughts on the topic.

1.) First do OSHA commercial diving rules apply? If I'm diving with my camera with the intention of selling photos, by most accounts I'm diving with businesses purposes thus being paid. Is this commercial diving as far as the law is concerned? I've read through OSHA rules and the only exemptions seem to be for scuba instructors teaching, scientific divers, government agencies and public safety divers. Many of the arguments for the exceptions granted for instructors would seem to apply to much of underwater photography, but I've seen no opinions on the topic. Moreover they may not apply if you are hired for some specific subject/ location.

If you are diving with your camera in the hope of selling photos at a later date, there is definitely no OSHA involvement. OSHA only comes into play when there is an employer/employee relationship. If you are diving with your camera taking pictures that someone else has requested, in general terms, such that you are in control of the time and place of the dive and you are billing them for the work ... then you're an independent contractor - no OSHA. If you are hired by an employer who is subject to OSHA (there are various requirements including the number of employees), who controls the time and place of your efforts ... then your employer needs to make sure that all OSHA requirements are met with respect to your employment ... it's not your problem.

2.) Does it mater if I'm diving for my own stock photo portfolio, or if I have a specific job commissioned by someone else?

See above.

I
3.) What about a paid assistant in the water? They are diving as an employee. What about a buddy that is not being paid, but is assumed to assist in the event of a problem?

If you are only paying one assistant to dive with you, then your company is not large enough to be subject to OSHA and it does not apply. BUT (and it's a big but) if something were to happen to that that person in the course of a dive that might have been mitigated by adherence to an OSHA regulation, you can bet that you'll be explaining in court why you did not adhere to that regulation on the basis of "best practice" rather than on the basis of requirement.

 

[Nemrod]

Believe it or not but there are not "regulations" for everything.

N

 

[M_Bipartitus]

I think my question was answered after a bit of reading. I see that commercial photography and video production are considered "low-risk" industries, so with fewer than 10 employees OSHA regulations do not directly apply.

Still I don't really want to be in a position of saying why I didn't have a designated person in charge and a safety diver waiting should I go diving with an assistant. As it seems that at leaset 4 people are required to meet the OSHA standards for two divers in the water.

 

[Thalassamania]

I think my question was answered after a bit of reading. I see that commercial photography and video production are considered "low-risk" industries, so with fewer than 10 employees OSHA regulations do not directly apply.

Still I don't really want to be in a position of saying why I didn't have a designated person in charge and a safety diver waiting should I go diving with an assistant. As it seems that at leaset 4 people are required to meet the OSHA standards for two divers in the water.

You're on the right track and have reached the right conclusions, however, you really only need three, there nothing to say that the designated person in charge can not be the safety diver or the team lead diver.

 

[Thalassamania]

You're on the right track and have reached the right conclusions, however, you really only need three, there nothing to say that the designated person in charge can not be the safety diver or the team lead diver.

Believe it or not but there are not "regulations" for everything.

N

There are real regulatory issues and concerns here, including liability for assistants and compliance with regulations without which the access to scientific operations is not available. For example, I had a heck of a time clearing Doug Allen and his assistant when they wanted to participate in an arctic cruise on our ship.

 

[Nemrod]

Quote OP

"I was interested if anyone had experience with what laws apply to taking photos underwater with the intent to sell them. "

The answer is NONE.

N

 

[Thalassamania]

Quote OP

"I was interested if anyone had experience with what laws apply to taking photos underwater with the intent to sell them. "

The answer is NONE.

N

At a a very simplistic level you are right, but there's more to the question than you are seeing or know about. I have a lot of respect for your views and attitudes, but in this case your black and white vision needs to be augmented with some shades of gray at least.

 

[Nemrod]

Seriously Thal, I think highly of you as well.

I have sold photography images in earlier times, not underwater, I did not comply with OSHA regs, oops, there was no OSHA, lol.

Again, it is true that I do like a black and white world and a black and white images but I think you guys are creating an issue that does not exist. Certainly if a person forms a company, hires divers, hires a ship and a professional captain and crew and sets out on an expedition there are numerous regulations that will apply at multiple levels ---however--- a private individual who does photography and occasionally sells some of his/her photos even if the intent from the beginning was to do so does not require a lawyer and OSHA approval. If so there are an awful lot of illegal photographs being taken and sold.

Thousands of amateur and semi professional photographers sell images all the time and I don't think being underwater when the shutter snaps changes your legal status, this is still a free country and light hitting my film is free.

I guess I don't understand the OPs question and don't see what you guys see.

Quote OP:

"I was interested if anyone had experience with what laws apply to taking photos underwater with the intent to sell them. I have a few questions for discussion. I'm aware most paid diving seams to be covered by OSHA commercial diving rules, but I have never heard it discussed in relation to underwater photography. I'm aware that few people seam to worry about it, but I live in an area that is very litigious and I'd like to hear some thoughts on the topic."

?????, I don't follow why you think you need a lawyer to take photographs??????

How much of your scuba equipment is OSHA approved, is your boat OSHA approved? Is your exposure protection OSHA approved? Is your safety equipment OSHA approved?

N

 

[Mariozi]

Sorry for adding my spoon to this discussion.
I am not from the US and never heard about OSHA before.

Checking it's website I got really overwhelmed by the amount of info and regulations.
But in general I draw 2 points:

By concept Regulating Agencies (like OSHA) are created as an incentive to the activity.
So normally what's not specifically described is permitted, and pretty much unregulated.
So if you have the qualification you can go ahead and shoot.

On the other hand U.S. of A. justice system based not on codes but on an archive of previous rulings tends to get more and more complicated with time.
Roman Justice as we have on most latin countries are simpler in this aspect, but not easily updated in turn.
I see both systems migrating towards each other, gathering what's best in each one.

Best advice I could give you is to use common sense, doing your best to ensure justice, clarity and safety in your so far unregulated work, is the best way to protect yourself.
And on your justice system you are a bit "protected" by several other official contracts, firmed between photographers and clients in the past without any reference to OSHA or other agency.

It seems to the outsider that the "very litigious" characteristics of your area has justifiably found a way into your way of thinking.

Good luck, hope I helped.