Ready to buy my own gear, however...

[GearheadExplorer85]

Hello there,

Just to start off, I have just joined the site and wanted to say hello to everyone. I am looking forward to going on more dives and meeting new faces

I have been diving for a little more than a year, and have been frequenting one shop which also happens to be the same one where I got my open water ticket. Up until now, I have owned my own wetsuit, mask, snorkel, boots, and gloves. I have been renting the BCDs, weights, tanks, and regulators. Now onto the problem...

The past two weekends, I have had two malfunctions with the rental gear. On the first incident, the pressure gauge malfunctioned. After bringing up the problem with a staff member who was at the dive site, he told me that the other staff in the store knew that the pressure gauge was faulty. After talking to the shop owner about it, he claimed that the problem was not communicated to him. Not knowing who to believe, I made it clear to the owner that if I was to continue my patronage, he would have to make sure that the rental gear was working properly. At the end of this conversation, the owner gave me a free gear rental. The second incident happened yesterday, while using the free rental gear. When I was at depth I began to inhale small droplets of water (This water didn't come in through the mouthpiece, I was literally inhaling droplets). In addition, air was seeping out of the low pressure hose connection to the BCD (apparently this was due to a broken o-ring).

At this point in time, I am convinced that I should own my own gear. My question to you all is this: Should I buy my gear from this dive shop? If this shop isn't proactive in checking their own rental gear, how do I know they will look after me when I have to have thousands of dollars in personal kit serviced?

Thank you in advance!

Crockett

 

[BVickery]

I would have a very hard time buying and let them service my gear. It seems the owner could honestly not be in the know about some gear in his shop (he does have people to look over stuff for him/bring to his attention). First talk to him and find out, it would suck if he himself is an upstanding LDS owner and only being failed by the people he employs.

Also, anyone know where you can send reports of such stuff so in case something tragic happens the responsible parties can be justly punished? I am no fan of lawsuits, but sometimes people only hurt when you touch their wallet, and if there is a pattern of negligence I am all for them being hurt badly.

 

[GearheadExplorer85]

I would have a very hard time buying and let them service my gear. It seems the owner could honestly not be in the know about some gear in his shop (he does have people to look over stuff for him/bring to his attention). First talk to him and find out, it would suck if he himself is an upstanding LDS owner and only being failed by the people he employs.

Also, anyone know where you can send reports of such stuff so in case something tragic happens the responsible parties can be justly punished? I am no fan of lawsuits, but sometimes people only hurt when you touch their wallet, and if there is a pattern of negligence I am all for them being hurt badly.

Just got back from the dive shop.

After returning my rental gear, I told the owner about the problem with the BCD hose and breathing in the water drops. Apparently an open water student returned that regulator a couple of hours prior to me renting it. If there was a problem with it, the student did not tell the dive shop staff about it. When I inspected it, I didn't notice anything wrong with it.

One of my dive buddies happened to be at the shop, and he has been getting work done on his gear there for a few years. He claims that he never had any problems, but acknowledged that some of the staff there were not communicating with the owner about rental gear problems. I asked the owner again today if he has confronted his employees about the equipment problems. He said that he has not and that he has been busy, but seemed very nonchalant about the whole ordeal.

The owner has offered me a good price on a BCD/reg/gauge/weight/tank package. Everything else in the package is brand new: Aqua Lung Titan LX reg with 2 gauges and compass, black ice bcd, and 30 lbs of lead. A used aluminum 80 tank was what I was going to buy. However, after a closer look, the tank was manufactured in 1991 and hasn't had a hydro test since 1996.

It seems like a good deal on gear, but I think I am going to walk away from this one. I am seeing a lot of red flags at this shop.

 

[Aguablanco1]

Having employees myself, I find it hard to believe that the owner is too busy to firmly and politely re instruct his staff on how to handle rental gear and what procedures to follow when problems are found. Too busy doing what? Shouldn't managing his employees be the top job since they are usually the ones on the front line with the customers? IMHO, if this owner has that much difficulty managing people, he has given you no reason to trust his judgement in other areas. If there are other shops locally try them and see how that works out. You can always go back if necessary, and your absence may shake him up enough to start managing properly.
RichH
PS 30# of lead? Are you Dexter getting rid of bodies?

 

[c5diver]

30# is not uncommon when you get into cold water diving ie drysuit

 

[GearheadExplorer85]

Having employees myself, I find it hard to believe that the owner is too busy to firmly and politely re instruct his staff on how to handle rental gear and what procedures to follow when problems are found. Too busy doing what? Shouldn't managing his employees be the top job since they are usually the ones on the front line with the customers? IMHO, if this owner has that much difficulty managing people, he has given you no reason to trust his judgement in other areas. If there are other shops locally try them and see how that works out. You can always go back if necessary, and your absence may shake him up enough to start managing properly.
RichH
PS 30# of lead? Are you Dexter getting rid of bodies?

****...he knows too much <pulls out pistol and screws on silencer> XD

Joking aside, the owner said that he went out of town for a family get together. However, he had the week before to talk to his employees and rectify this. I didn't buy his story about how he was too busy to do it.

This morning, I called and left a message on the owners voicemail that I was not going to be purchasing his gear package. He has not called back, if that is an indication of anything.

I am sure some of you are wondering what shop I am having these problems at. I don't feel comfortable revealing this because I like to think that the shop owner will pull up his socks and change his business practices.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Ain't gonna happen I'm guessing.

 

[BackBite]

I'm sorry your LDS has let you down. I've been dealing with mine for almost a year prior to getting my OW cert (purchased snorkel gear, which was my gateway drug so to speak!) and I adore them! Was lucky enough to buy some older gear that a friend can no longer use (ear tubes) and that included three tanks. They ensured none were in the suspect group of aluminum tanks that were prone to go bad, had hydro and vis taken care of, made sure everything was lubricated and had o-rings, and filled them for me. I point blank asked the owner if he would be willing to dive with any of the three and without hesitation he said he would without question! I purchased most of my gear from them, though I did get some inconsequential stuff on my own through amazon and whatnot. Some things I'm not willing to order online yet (wetsuit, BCD) and wanted to try them on. Ended up with a 3mm Aqualung suit that feels a hundred times better than the rental suit I wore last time around, as well as the Pearl BCD. Surprised everyone, including myself, when the L was actually too big (I'd worn a L for OW and kept thinking it was too big for me) and the M, while snug, still has room to be tightened if need be. Wore it around the store, took it into the dressing room to wear on top of the suit...all is well and I can't wait to get it wet next weekend!

Find a Dive Shop you trust, because if you don't, I don't think you'll be happy with anything you purchase or have serviced by them. If I'd had any issues with the gear like you had during dives, I'm not sure that I would have stayed with this shop. The employees and instructors bent over backwards to make sure we had good working gear, and usually had a few spares hanging around in case of emergencies (we did OW 2 hours away from shop). If gear happened to malfunction (blown or missing o-rings, etc) they always took that opportunity to stop, show us what happened and why the gear was no longer fit for diving until it was serviced/repaired.

 

[Colliam7]

I have been renting the BCDs, weights, tanks, and regulators. Now onto the problem... The past two weekends, I have had two malfunctions with the rental gear. On the first incident, the pressure gauge malfunctioned. After bringing up the problem with a staff member who was at the dive site, he told me that the other staff in the store knew that the pressure gauge was faulty. After talking to the shop owner about it, he claimed that the problem was not communicated to him. Not knowing who to believe, I made it clear to the owner that if I was to continue my patronage, he would have to make sure that the rental gear was working properly. At the end of this conversation, the owner gave me a free gear rental. The second incident happened yesterday, while using the free rental gear. When I was at depth I began to inhale small droplets of water (This water didn't come in through the mouthpiece, I was literally inhaling droplets). In addition, air was seeping out of the low pressure hose connection to the BCD (apparently this was due to a broken o-ring). . . . My question to you all is this: Should I buy my gear from this dive shop? If this shop isn't proactive in checking their own rental gear, how do I know they will look after me when I have to have thousands of dollars in personal kit serviced?

There is no reason to not buy from the shop on the basis of the two incidents. There may be other reasons to look elsewhere, but what you describe is not one of them.

1. What was the problem with the SPG? When you say it malfunctioned, what happened? Apparently it was 'faulty' in some way, but I am curious what that means - not challenging the statement, just trying to understand what the manifestation of the malfunction was.

2. You had a shop staff member tell you that 'the other staff in the store knew that the pressure gauge was faulty'. Hmm, sounds like a bit of hearsay to me, plus I question the motivation of a shop staff member saying what you apparently heard. As for the owner not knowing, that is quite plausible. For example, did the staff member who said that 'other staff . . knew' the gauge was faulty bother to tell the owner? Or, was he just content saying that others knew it was faulty, and by implication blaming them for not taking action?

3. Air seeping from around the connection of the low pressure hose to the BCD is not unheard of, nor is it necessarily dangerous or dive-ending (I presume you were seeing bubbles). If it is reported by a customer, it should be corrected. If it is not reported, it won't be.

4. The wet breathing regulator second stage could reflect a problem that occurred on the previous rental, after use in the water, and therefore not something that was reported to the shop. A student uses gear, inadvertently sits on the second stage, or allows a cylinder to fall on it, and the housing cracks. The student doesn't realize what happened (and may not want to report it for fear of having to pay for a repair), but the cracked housing breathes 'wet'. I have had that happen more than a few times before. One easy solution during the dive - breathe off the alternate second stage, if the 'wetness' is particularly bothersome.

In general, busy dive shops DO NOT check rental gear for functionality when it is returned, UNLESS the customer mentions a problem. If a customer does not report a problem, there is little reason to check the gear, beyond possibly emptying water from the BCD (which many customers for some reason do not seem to think is necessary for them to do), or putting the aperture cover back in place on a yoke reg aperture (which many customers for some reason do not seem to think is necessary for them to do) and rinsing and drying the gear before hanging it up.

We do annual service on all rental gear, and we certainly service gear that is reported to have a problem. We do not necessarily check all gear before it goes out on rental.

I would not necessarily interpret the owner's actions as uncaring or non-chalant. Of course, it may be that the owner really is a 'dirt-bag' (a technical business term). But, it is also possible that the owner really is busy. You haven't described anything that would necessarily require him to 'confront' staff, other than to follow up on the assertion that at least some staff knew a SPG was 'faulty' and did nothing about it. What is it you want him to 'rectify'?