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Question for active DMs and Instructors ...

Discussion in 'Going Pro' started by CAPTAIN SINBAD, Feb 8, 2016.

  1. TMHeimer

    TMHeimer Divemaster

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Dartmouth,NS,Canada(Eastern Passage-Atlantic)
    11,968
    2,520
    113
    Ahh, one of my favourite topics. I believe I did it in 12-13 minutes to score a "3". Back then ('09) with PADI you needed 12 points to pass, as the equipment exchange was separate and P/F. Some of you guys still talk about swimming ability when doing something on scuba. And back to the old "definition of swimming"discussion--With fins on and/or full scuba you are not "swimming". You are kicking correctly and powerfully if need be. Not "swimming". If you are only with fins (mask, snorkel perhaps), you CAN use your arms to perform a proper crawl stroke (I've tried it--it WORKS.....) and shoot like a rocket to rescue someone (I've never done this). You also can use arms in full scuba while diving, in certain situations.
     
  2. TONY CHANEY

    TONY CHANEY Loggerhead Turtle

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Mount Holly, NC
    1,739
    602
    113
    I can still do it, I believe, but see no use for it. If I am at a dive site, then I will have my gear with me. I would rather use the fins and mask than trying to swim 400 yards without the equipment. Having had saved someone from drowning I would have preferred to have fins instead of just trunks. OTOH, I can get to the victim even faster with my scooter.
     
  3. Germie

    Germie Cave Instructor

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Netherlands
    510
    347
    63
    I am a swimmer, so can still swim 1 km in 16.30 minutes (last summer competition in ow).
     
  4. Trace Malinowski

    Trace Malinowski Cave Instructor

    # of Dives: 5,000 - ∞
    Location: Alexandria Bay, NY
    2,325
    2,499
    113
    I had an instructor candidate get into trouble while training for his required swim in open water in Turks & Caicos. I had to swim out and render assistance without a rescue tube or can in choppy seas with rips. Since most accidents end up at the surface, often unexpectedly, I advocate full lifeguard training in addition to scuba rescue training for anyone who wants to be a dive pro. That day I relied on years of lifeguard/lifeguard instructor retesting skills. Rescues can kick your butt even when you train for them. Scientific research has shown that 500 yards/meters in less than 10 minutes isn't enough to simulate the physical output of a rescue. Sandy Hook, NJ lifeguards actually make use of the science that suggested 600 yards in less than 10 minutes is more appropriate as part of their swim test. I swim daily in open water during the summer months. I used to swim year-round, but I currently belong to a gym with no pool. In winter, I normally teach cave so a long open water swimming rescue is unlikely. At the start of summer I make sure my swim skills are up to par when it is foreseeable that I may need to make a swimming rescue.
     
  5. TONY CHANEY

    TONY CHANEY Loggerhead Turtle

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Mount Holly, NC
    1,739
    602
    113
    " Since most accidents end up at the surface, often unexpectedly, I advocate full lifeguard training in addition to scuba rescue training for anyone who wants to be a dive pro."

    I'll agree to the first part simple because you are adding ALL water activities when the majority of accidents being at the surface. I totally disagree for the additional training for a Rescue Scuba diver. Maybe we should also change the requirements from BLS to ACLS and PALS. There is nothing wrong with additional training but you have to make the requirements obtainable to the majority.
     
  6. Frosty

    Frosty Divemaster

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Auckland NZ
    1,264
    423
    83
    I can now do 1000m in 22 minutes in the sea with a 300mm (1 foot) chop. How does it relate to my job.? It means Im at a level of fitness needed to assist a customer. case in Point-last night doing a tired diver tow for 100m against a current to shore. So DIRECTLY I haven't (so far) used swimming but it has massive secondary benefits.
     
  7. TMHeimer

    TMHeimer Divemaster

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Dartmouth,NS,Canada(Eastern Passage-Atlantic)
    11,968
    2,520
    113
    Of course I agree. But remember that you ARE a (basically competitive, I don't know?) swimmer. One with well developed muscles for the sport of swimming. Others can be in equally good physical shape through other activities, be a decent enough swimmer to score OK on the DM test, and be equally equipped to handle dive emergencies and rescues--with fins on. One could be a 20 year old Schwarzenegger and sink like a stone after 10 yards.
     
  8. Frosty

    Frosty Divemaster

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Auckland NZ
    1,264
    423
    83
    TMheimer-I get what you are saying but I genuinely feel that it a question of fitness for task. Beeing fit doesn't convert to swim/dive fit. or in simple terms rescue dive fit.
     
  9. jstrang

    jstrang Instructor, Scuba

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: burlington, ON, CANADA
    91
    69
    18
    I really enjoyed the 400m swim when I did my DM program. Mind you I am a swimmer and did it in just over 5 minutes. The 800m kick with fins was over 14 minutes. If I had to rescue someone I would swim.

    Being comfortable in the water has made a huge difference. A little water up the nose, student kicking my mask off, kicking hard to catch the tow rope in current, surface swim to join up with a drifting swimmer. All issues I was more comfortable with because of watermanship exercises.

    Mind you our CD still talks about a ex-Olympic swimmer that was useless as a DM. He did the 400m swim in 4 minutes.
     
  10. abscuba

    abscuba Nassau Grouper

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Florida
    141
    35
    28
    I have had to pull divers and even new DMs out of current that was taking them to rocks on shore through current with gear. It is very important that you are a decent swimmer to work as a dive professional. When it comes time to do a rescue it will be very physically demanding and will require a DM or Inst to be able to tow some one through the water often over a distance in open water, pull them out, and if there is not a boat get them up on shore. Folks will get a taste of this in the rescue class, but there is generally no waves, no current, the distance is not that far, put that in real life with a diver in distress on the surface in current they are to tired to swim against in waves along a rocky shore now fitness is key. A DM doesn't need to be an olympian, but does need to be a decent swimmer.
     

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