Purchase BC or BP/W?

[Vercingetorix]

I'm about to lay-out cash for my next piece of gear: BC. I already own a reg (Aeris Pro, Mares Octo, Oceanic Veo 250 computer console). I've got a Zeagle Brigade on lay-away. But I'm slowly starting to queston the wisdom of this choice. Not the quality of the BC rig; rather, do I want to go BC or BP/W?

I realize such a broad question will engender much discussion, agreement, and heated debate. Good. I further realize basic questions must be answered:
1. What kind of diving will I do? Recreational, wreck, cave, tech, nekkid,etc? I'm open to all posissibilities, except the last. Texas lakes are far too cold, otherwise...<GRIN>

2. What is my budget? For purposes of this discussion, I'm in the $400 to $600 range. Beyond $600, I may have to put a divorce lawyer on retainer, which would further reduce my dive gear budget.

3. What is my experience? I'm NAUI OW certified with only the 5 certification dives under my belt.

During the pool and OW dives, I used the Zeagle Brigade exclusively; this is a back-inflate. Several folks recommmended it. I prefer back-inflate, so BP/W is a simple transition.

For me, the scope of the debate centers on the convenience of the all-in-one BC with it's integrated weight system, pockets, D-rings versus the BP/W which requires a weight belt and fewer D-rings, and no pockets. The BP/W has less bouyancy than the BC and therefore, requires less weighting. An SS backplate may mean no weight at all, dependent upon whether I'm in freshwater or salt.

A BP/W with a 50-55# lift and STA means I can go doubles or single tank A BC is designed either for a single or a double. The Brigade I used had a 45# Ranger bladder.

The crux of my indecsion is my gross lack of experience. I would love to try a BP/W, even in a pool. If I go BP/W, I'll probably go with Golem Gear as they have excellent prices and their cost-to-quality value appears good as well.

So, it all comes down to: what is the difference in technique when diving a BP/W versus a BC?

 

[MSilvia]

A BP/W with a 50-55# lift and STA means I can go doubles or single tank A BC is designed either for a single or a double. The Brigade I used had a 45# Ranger bladder.

In my experience, all-purpose wings are a poor choice. They do work for both doubles and single tanks... if you consider working poorly acceptable. You'll likely be much happier getting a wing in the 30# range for single tanks, and getting a doubles wing if and when you decide you want to dive doubles.

The crux of my indecsion is my gross lack of experience. I would love to try a BP/W, even in a pool.

Definately try one out if you can. Preferably before making a final buying decision.

So, it all comes down to: what is the difference in technique when diving a BP/W versus a BC?

Not much difference in technique, but it may take a few dives to get a BP/W set up correctly.

 

[Alex777]

I will let others reply with regard to tech/wreck/cave diving. For plain vanilla recreational diving (my kind), a BP/W is still preferable IMHO to a BC. With a bit of thought & planning, you can buy a BP/W setup which frees you of the need to wear a weight belt or any weight at all. You can buy for tropical diving one of the really small wings with 18 or 20 lbs. of lift and get a nice streamlined profile while swimming. You can move the D-rings around to suit your own preferences & gear configuration. If you are worried about the reliability of plastic snaps, you can buy a Hog harness instead (a single piece of webbing for shoulder straps & waist belt). And if you want to go "Tropical Minimalist", you can remove the wing!

In your price range of $400 - $600, you should have no problem acquiring a good BP/W setup.

 

[Divin'Papaw]

I agree with Matt. Don't try to get one wing that will meet all possible future needs. That'll only give you a wing that doesn't do anything particularly well. I went with the DSS steel backplate and the 30 lb wing. I made the right choice for me and I'm very happy with the rig. If down the road someday I decide to move up to doubles, I'll get a doubles wing at that point in time, and possibly an AL backplate depending upon the type of diving I'll be doing. But that is WAY down the road, if at all, for me. The 30 lb wing will support any of the single tank diving that I'll be doing for years to come.

EDIT: Oh, and mine rig easily fell within your price range.

 

[scarefaceDM]

I agree with Matt

One All-purpose wing does not cut it. Doubles set up require a wide wing as a single needs a smaller wing.

I followed a simple rule a buddy of mine showed me. For recreational diving with singles or doubles using a back plate and wing.

Size of wing.
Singles: 28 -40 lbs lift. Narrow to fit a single tank. Makes you more streamlined in the water.
Doubles: 45-70 lbs wider wing to accomidate a set of double tanks. The amount of lift needed is dictated by the type of diving your going to be doing. Slinging stage bottles etc..needs a little more lift.

Simple

A doubles wing is not set up for singels diving even with an STA..the wing flaps around and throws you off...where the single wing will be tight to the body and be stable in the water.

Consider the path you want to take. and get your gear accordingly.

 

[Vercingetorix]

OK, let's broaden the scope.

Other than DIR and weighting, are there other advantages to BP/W versus BC? What BC advantages might I miss if I go BP/W?

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I have to support all of the previos opinions and add that having dove a jacket style for two years and then trying my buddy's back inflate both in the pool and in ow, I don't for a minute regret now diving a BPW except when assisting with classes as a DM and the instructor prefers that I use my jacket style with a conventional reg set up. I have the DSS single tank rig with the lcd 30 wing and as Jim said it falls easily with in your price range. If necessary you can add a couple extra d-rings but I have yet to find a need to do that. I do have one of the Bryden Buckles available from Green Manelishi here on the board on my right side to secure the cannister for my light. As for pockets you can order from Diverite Express a thigh pocket that threads onto either side of the harness and fastens to your thigh with straps. It works very well. I also have a standard one from them that just threads onto the harness and I use this when not using the can light to route my long hose. Even with one or both of these you are still in your price range. I also have the lcd50 wing for my doubles. As for weighting in a 5 mil Bare velocity I used to put 8 lbs in my integrated pockets in freshwater to be properly weighted with one of my HP80's. With the BPW and steel plate I use no extra weight. Last year in the keys I was diving with 16 lbs in my bc with an al80 and that same suit. I figure with the BPW I'll be abler to drop at least 6-8 of that. The remainder I'll carry in a conventional belt with xs scuba weight pockets. I have 4 of them so I'll be able to put the weight right where I need it. I can even put one or two with a 2lb'er on the camband to get more weight off my waist. And down the road I agree it's best to use a wing that is intended for doubles rather than trying to get one that does double (pardon the pun) duty. It's either going to be too small for large doubles or too big for singles.

 

[undefined]

I'll play devils advocate since no one else has.

Get a BC you are comfortable with and go dive. When you make the transition to BP/W do so after having some experience diving and more time to consider the correct setup for your desired diving style and purpose. A general purpose BC, be it rear inflate or jacket style, is satisfactory for non-tech OW diving purposes. A poorly selected BP/W setup may put you at a disadvantage as you do not have any experience with BP/W and those you dive with may not be familiar with it.

When I man up to taking the DIR-F I'll get an appropriate rig. Until then, you'll see me in a boring run-of-the-mill-I'm-a-stroke-and-accept-it BC.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

OK, let's broaden the scope.

Other than DIR and weighting, are there other advantages to BP/W versus BC? What BC advantages might I miss if I go BP/W?

I can see none that you would miss with proper thought and planning of your gear configuration. Pockets can be added and placed where you want them. Not where someone else thinks they should be. Integrated weights? If you are properly weighted you should not need any dumpable weight, you should be able to swim your rig up from any depth. Quick releases? I have one on my harness waist belt, it's called a knife. If it becomes necessary to ditch my rig I can get out of it as fast as I can with my other bc and if it's an emergency it's 15 bucks worth of webbing. I can also fit my entire setup minus my heavier wetsuit(my lightweight polar fleece that is equal to a 3mil will fit) in my new Oceanic AT4pak which meets airline carry on regs. So no baggage gorillas going thru my stuff. Every piece of life support equipment is on the plane with me in one bag. That is a big plus.

 

[mudhole]

. . . I've got a Zeagle Brigade on lay-away. But I'm slowly starting to queston the wisdom of this choice. Not the quality of the BC rig; rather, do I want to go BC or BP/W?
1. What kind of diving will I do? Recreational, wreck, cave, tech, nekkid,etc? I'm open to all posissibilities, except the last. Texas lakes are far too cold, otherwise...<GRIN> . . .
3. What is my experience? I'm NAUI OW certified with only the 5 certification dives under my belt.

For me, the scope of the debate centers on the convenience of the all-in-one BC with it's integrated weight system, pockets, D-rings versus the BP/W which requires a weight belt and fewer D-rings, and no pockets. . . .I can go doubles or single tank A BC is designed either for a single or a double. The Brigade I used had a 45# Ranger bladder.

The crux of my indecsion is my gross lack of experience. I would love to try a BP/W, even in a pool. If I go BP/W, I'll probably go with Golem Gear as they have excellent prices and their cost-to-quality value appears good as well. . . .So, it all comes down to: what is the difference in technique when diving a BP/W versus a BC?

As a new diver, you're jumping in over your head to buy too much, too soon. Any good fitting jacket will be comfortable in the water, and will give you years of service with a single or double tank. . . If your plans are to dive wrecks or caves and you have the dive buddies leading in this direction then a BP/W may be important to you. . . don't even think about wreck or cave diving classes till you have 100 or more dives before advanced training. The benefits of a BP/W are useful in technical dives or trying to look like it.