PSD and Good Samaritan Law

[skyman_BLFD]

I am attempting to convince my Department why we need actual Public Safety Dive traing and not Recreation training. I informed them that we need it because we are rescueing and/or recovering victims and for liabilty puropses. (I know I don't feel like getting personally sued.) In the precceeding arguement, it was thrown out that we would covered by the Good Samaritan Law. So I've been doing some reseach for Indiana Law and have found that the only Public Safety service that is covered is the EMS and Paramedics with Firsts Responders only covered when using an AED.

What is your opinion and/or findings on the Good Samaritan Law covering PSD?

 

[Gary D.]

Get trained! You seem to be working with morons who don't have a clue just how dangerous this business can be.

 

[fedfirediver]

I have to agree with Gary

 

[BladesRobinson]

Indiana public safety divers have paid the ultimate price as evidenced by the following fatality reports...

http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/fire/pdfs/face200215.pdf
http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/fire/pdfs/face200038.pdf

Your agency will be better served if the divers are trained as Public Safety Divers, by Public Safety Divers/Instructors who have the skill, ability and knowledge to provide this training safely.

Your department will have considerable liability if their divers are not trained as "Public Safety Divers" and a phone call to the Indianapolis Fire Department may assist your administrators in making a good decision. Know that there are many PSDs and PSD teams with lots of experience. The question is, do they have experience being lucky or have experience based on the time proven principals taught in legitimate PSD training programs?

The liability to your department will not come from citizens demanding better service. It will come from widows and family members of deceased divers who will demand to know why the agency did not provide their loved one with proper, job specific training. There are many attorneys who would love to take on such a case and the litigation that took place following the 2002 fatality in Indianapolis would prove the point.

The shame here is this should not be a liability concern, it should be a safety concern. There is plenty of evidence that shows how recreational diver training is inadequate for public safety divers. The recreational programs do a great job providing a foundation for diving but Public Safety Diving is very different from Recreational Diving. It is surprising to me that an agency would never allow a civilian to make entry into a fire and "show water" nor would they allow a recreational hunter to assist in a SWAT operation. The reason is because it takes specialized training to do SWAT operations or interior fire attacks. Yet some of these agencies are very content allowing civilians or agency personel with recreational diver training to perform high risk public safety diving operations.

It is no wonder that an overwhelming majority of dive related line of duty deaths involves divers who never participated in a public safety diver training program.

Good luck with your efforts.

 

[BladesRobinson]

Indiana public safety divers have paid the ultimate price as evidenced by the following fatality reports...

http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/fire/pdfs/face200215.pdf

The liability to your department will not come from citizens demanding better service. It will come from widows and family members of deceased divers who will demand to know why the agency did not provide their loved one with proper, job specific training. There are many attorneys who would love to take on such a case and the litigation that took place following the 2002 fatality in Indianapolis would prove the point.

Here is an exerpt from the a 2002 Indianapolis Star article regarding the settlement a widow received from the department ...

"There's no such thing as closure in this because I've got two kids who will never get to know their father," she said.

The city of Indianapolis reached a settlement with Wendy Jolliff on Dec. 10 that will pay her family $300,000 and cover medical insurance indefinitely for her and her two children, under numerous stipulations.

In the settlement, the city also indicates it will sue Sunier* for as much as $1.3 million.

​

*Note: Sunier was the scuba instructor providing the training.

 

[skyman_BLFD]

Sometimes I feel like I'm surrounded by morons. I work in a jail and then have to put up with a select few at the firehouse.

 

[james croft]

What usually happens to an improperly trained team is that there is an accident and the agency immediately disbands the unit or they bite the bullet and begin to get the proper training and gear that they should have had to begin with.

 

[tc]

Can't speak to other states good Samaritan laws but in California it only applies for off duty situations, where there is no duty to act.

Any on-duty paid or volunteer rescuer, LE officer, medic, EMT, etc. that has a legal duty to act is not covered.

As stated above get some training from a qualified public safety dive instructor.

The absolute best way to avoid liability is to avoid an accident in the first place. (Your team members and their families will appreciate this philosophy too)

 

[Dive Right In Scuba]

We have a PSD Day at Haigh Quarry which isn't too far over the border on Sept. 29th if you and some of the higher ups want to come by and talk to other teams.

I attached the Flyer for you. We will have a car that is going to be launched, pulled, launched again. A full decon truck station with John Drewniak from Whites, Humminbird is hoping to come by, and we are going to have a ton of things to keep you busy and learning. Not to mention rubbing elbows with other teams and staying in touch with what works and what doesn't.