Problem trimming out with two deco tanks

[ChuckP]

I've never done it that way because one of my early instructors calls it being slefish, and it really is if you think about it. It may be more comfortable for you having one on each side, but you're basically telling your buddy they're on their own in a situation where you need to donate the long hose since it's trapped.

I absolutely don't buy that at all - selfish, telling your buddy you are on your own?? So a PADI, SSI, SDI open water diver, anyone taught on a 40" second or God forbid, an Air2 is selfish and telling their buddy they are on their own?

A 5' hose under your arm, under a deco tank, across your chest, around your neck and clipped off has more than enough hose to donate and gain control of the situation.

I dive side mount too and have come to the conclusion that I'll never dive four tanks, in that situation, for me, I think the long hose tucked under the second tank is too constricting. My chest area is too cluttered to manage safely passing off a second - but deco tanks in back mount are much freer, your chest area is less cluttered and I feel no sense of any issue in donating.

I certainly appreciate the intention of the training, I also enjoy the diving that is comfortable and every bit as safe.

 

[rddvet]

I absolutely don't buy that at all - selfish, telling your buddy you are on your own?? So a PADI, SSI, SDI open water diver, anyone taught on a 40" second or God forbid, an Air2 is selfish and telling their buddy they are on their own?

A 5' hose under your arm, under a deco tank, across your chest, around your neck and clipped off has more than enough hose to donate and gain control of the situation.

I dive side mount too and have come to the conclusion that I'll never dive four tanks, in that situation, for me, I think the long hose tucked under the second tank is too constricting. My chest area is too cluttered to manage safely passing off a second - but deco tanks in back mount are much freer, your chest area is less cluttered and I feel no sense of any issue in donating.

I certainly appreciate the intention of the training, I also enjoy the diving that is comfortable and every bit as safe.

I’m only relaying what my first tech instructor used as his example of why deco bottle on the right isn’t preferred. We’re not talking about Ow diving here so that’s a moot point.
My5’2” 105lb wife can carry two al80s and an al40 on her left side without issue in both bm and sm and she’s got less real estate than most of us. Everybody can dive how they want and I wouldn’t not dive with someone carrying bottles on their right side. But I also agree with all of my tech instructors who were against a bottle on the right. Though I agree you can minimize the risk of long hose entrapment if you’re careful, but why risk it at all when it’s pretty easy to put them all on the left.

 

[divingx]

+1 on shortening up the leashes on the stages - usually on one of your 80s with the long tailed 80 riding above.

Thanks. I’ll try it this weekend.

 

[ChuckP]

I’m only relaying what my first tech instructor used as his example of why deco bottle on the right isn’t preferred. We’re not talking about Ow diving here so that’s a moot point.
My5’2” 105lb wife can carry two al80s and an al40 on her left side without issue in both bm and sm and she’s got less real estate than most of us. Everybody can dive how they want and I wouldn’t not dive with someone carrying bottles on their right side. But I also agree with all of my tech instructors who were against a bottle on the right. Though I agree you can minimize the risk of long hose entrapment if you’re careful, but why risk it at all when it’s pretty easy to put them all on the left.

How she has enough square footage is beyond me!

 

[RyanT]

"left lean, right rich" runs the risk of trapping the long hose. I find that with luxfers the weight issue isn't a big deal.

In training, my instructor demonstrated to me how this can easily happen. Just clip both the left side.

Getting your trim really is a matter of practice with your rig. I clearly remember the first time I dove a set of doubles, it hung me on my head and I couldn't trim at all. A few dives later, I had it worked out. You just need a place where you can kit up and practice. Sometimes it's a matter of adjusting the position of your deco bottles a little and then a little practice.

 

[rddvet]

How she has enough square footage is beyond me!

working space on her chest has always been an issue, but she can make it work. It gets slightly trickier when she’s on ccr with two sm tanks, a stage, a deco bottle, and dil and oxy mags to deal with. The one pro to being wide shouldered and a little fat is I’ve got plenty of space.

 

[MichaelMc]

My5’2” 105lb wife can carry two al80s and an al40 on her left side without issue in both bm and sm and she’s got less real estate than most of us.

Her size means the tanks are closer to her centerline than someone larger, so there is less of a lever that the imbalance is acting on. Making her at best a very mixed example.

 

[ChuckP]

working space on her chest has always been an issue, but she can make it work. It gets slightly trickier when she’s on ccr with two sm tanks, a stage, a deco bottle, and dil and oxy mags to deal with. The one pro to being wide shouldered and a little fat is I’ve got plenty of space.

I dive for fun and to me, the 200' OC dives are as much work as I want to do. I had full intentions on doing Tri Mix 2 but after seeing those dives, it's just not worth it IMO.

Caves are another thing, I suppose if you could drop some stuff off on the way in, maybe it'd be ok but it's gotta be super special back there.....

I'm gonna do the rebreather route to stretch the bottom times a little bit and He is just stupid expensive here but still, carrying that third extra bottle is more than I want to do unless it's something spectacular. Maybe to up my interest, I'll try caves but there's a lot to see in the ocean first, they say there's some good caves across the pond though...

 

[rddvet]

Her size means the tanks are closer to her centerline than someone larger, so there is less of a lever that the imbalance is acting on. Making her at best a very mixed example.

I was more referencing that people move bottles to the right due to clutter as well as trim. She can do it and safely deal with the clutter so there’s no excuse for other people not to be able to. As for trimming out that’s just time and experience.

 

[NothingClever]

I can only speak about what I’ve personally learned through T&E with 2 x AL80s in a LLRR configuration. I have never received any instruction on LLRR so I probably have hillbilly technique.

I’ve found it’s best to don your rich tin before routing your LH. I’ve stowed my LH first and then donned my rich tin only to discover during the S-drill that I tied my shoelaces together. It sucks burning up a minute of descent/BT while I undork myself and that’s in calm waters. Hot drop, negative entry with a current and trying to dive bomb a wreck Lauderdale style? Ouch...definitely a way to spike your heart rate and needlessly eat 10 (or more) bar before your dive even gets started.

Rather than my LH coming down behind my shoulder then into my waistbelt and up the front of my torso like sane people do, my LH comes forward from my first stage over my shoulder and then down the front of my torso to my waistbelt and then up like normal from there. With a fixed turret first stage, this routing is REALLY hard on the LH rubber at the ferrule but my LH deployment is clean this way. Stowing it again after the drill is a faffercise, a combination of faff and exercise. It's obviously key to route your hose inboard from your D-ring.

I recently put behind me my Adv Nitrox diapers and graduated to wearing Trimix Pullups. During my Helium potty training in Florida, I got to use for the first time 2 x AL40s on the left. Why the first time? Because where I normally dive in the resplendent Kingdom of the Al Saud house, AL40s just aren’t available for purchase or rent. Having some shipped to me would cost $178. On top of that would be a customs duty. Not biting.

If given a choice between 2 x AL40s stacked on the left and 2 x AL80s in LLRR, I’m all kinds of in love with 2 x AL40s on the left side. Like Jasmine said, it's whole new world.

However, in Saudi Arabia, one doesn't have much choice but to use AL80s because (a) dependable fills are problematic to source so getting the maximum volume is beneficial, (b) it costs the same (flat rate) to fill an AL80 as it does an AL40 and (c) deco refills aren't available on the LOBs. With an AL40, I can get two OW deco dives if the profile is relatively tame and contingent on my mate having enough backgas to deco (in the event he loses a deco tin on our second dive if it were with an AL40). With an AL80, I can definitely get three, maybe even four OW deco dives depending on the profile (same thing, mate has to be able to deco on backgas). So, with AL80s I can get on a LOB and be self-sufficient for the weekend and deco my mate.

Sometimes you just have to use AL80s. I know some folks have trouble wrapping their heads around that but, as the saying goes, it is what it is. It's just dive logistics.

FOLLOW UP: To pull myself back on topic, I’ve tried donning 2 x AL80s on my left before. Actually, near the end of one dive I rehearsed carrying three AL80s and found I could manage it OK. But it was a bit of hassle and the oscillation is annoying so it just made better sense to me to balance myself out with a LLRR configuration. As long as I can quickly and cleanly deploy my LH, I think LLRR is an acceptable technique with AL80s.