PADI responded to their OW swim requirement...

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SparticleBrane:
I'm not an instructor...so yeah, I don't know the NAUI standard.
All the university standards we have are above and beyond basic NAUI standards. I'm not trying to cock an attitude or anything...but just stating facts. Thus, I'm not worried about meeting the NAUI standards, because as long as we meet the university standards we're good to go. :)

Since you aren't an instructor, you don't need to know the standards. OTOH, unless you know the standards of both NAUI and the university, you can't possibly know that the university standards are "above and beyond basic NAUI standards." They very probably are, but unless you know the standards, you are assuming. If you are certifying through NAUI, you are required to meet or exceed all NAUI standards.
 
friscuba:
I know at least an agency or two (likely more) frown on making mandatory skill tests above and beyond their base requirements.

I know at least two that encourage it.
 
Thalassamania:
I prefer number 6.:D

With trendy chemical amusement aids?

I dunno...some of the lax in standards seems like individual instrustor issues...I had to do the 200 yard swim, no time limit, but no stopping and a 10 minute float, no matter how we dd it, just as long as we stayed above water for 10 minutes, no noodles, floaties etc...

It wasn't a problem, I trained for it at this wicked huge pool down in Fort Lauderdale!

The hardest part about the float was I couldn't do it with an adult beverage in hand!:beerchug:
 
OHGoDive:
I'm curious. At the point of completion of the swim test, what can you extrapolate to potential diving ability? Is it more to simply weed out those who should not be diving, or are there more subtle distinctions that you can make?

The reason I ask is because my two sons swim competitively. My youngest, at 14, can swim a 500 yard freestyle in a bit over 5 minutes. My oldest is a sprinter, but has no problem keeping up with his younger sibling.

Their father, alas, no longer can compete with them, time wise. I could complete your time test, but it would be significantly closer to the upper limit than these two. But, if you had the three of us in a class, would the differences matter to you at that point, given the ravages of aging, or would you simply feel we were all "teachable".

I guess what I'm asking is, what can someones swimming ability really tell you about a potential diver. Or is it more an issue of comfort, overall fitness, and ability to deal with stress? (Although my sons were not stressed in the least by PADI's swimming tests, nor would they be by yours).

(For extra credit, given that we just crossed paths in the fitness/obesity thread, how many divers certified at 20 something do you think could still pass the swimming standards in their 50's, and, do you think it matters?)
Let me tell you the truth, intelligent swim tests are smoke and mirror shows disguised as initiation rites. The things that you learn go many levels deep, let me show you the top level.

It is important that the test appears to have some challenge and to create a bit of nervousness in all candidates except the competitive swimmers. But the time requirements should set so that an old fart like me or you husband could complete it with smarts (e.g., sidestroke all the way). When I see an old guy (I remember swim testing a General from the National Guard … an ex-Green Beret gone to well … beer and the wife of the University President, they looked at it, dove in and back-stroked and side-side stroked and finished a few seconds a head of the limit – no problem with them).

Now let’s take the competitive swimmers. What do they do? What’s their attitude? Matter of fact or cocky? Do they try and knock of 25 second splits? I may worry more about trouble in class with someone like your 14 year old than a desk jockey like the General.

For the folks in between, its a question of judging their acclimatization to water, problem signs are the ones who start off great guns and then flag, consistency shows knowledge of self and of one’s ability. Candidates you do not breathe properly, whatever the stroke, should also be closely watched.

You see, you … like the candidates are focused on the wrong thing, the distance and the time. What I’m most interested in is not the destination but the journey. In order to get a “clean read” on the journey we need to make it look a little macho and a little tough … it really isn’t. For me to teach you to dive I need to know that you are not afraid of the water, at the swim test I find that out … and a whole lot, a huge whole lot more.

And the last think I tell them is: “Next week, when we come to the pool, each and every one of you is going to hold your breath for a minimum of 90 seconds, and many of you will go a full two minutes. You don’t believe it? Neither did the last class through here, but the all did it.” And they always do, no muss, no fuss (again, just something, like the approach to swim testing that I stole, this time from Walt Hedricks Sr.)
 
I wasn't asked to do a swim - neither 1 yard nor 200. I sure am not going to give up my card though but then again, I think my deco card will be more readily accepted than the OW. :D
 
friscuba:
I'll read further into the thread, but I saw this and had to comment. Do you actually require your OW students to be able to meet these specific swims before certification? I suspect with at least a couple agencies, that would be a violation of standards in itself. I can see suggesting it would be wise to be able to do those things, but I know at least an agency or two (likely more) frown on making mandatory skill tests above and beyond their base requirements.
Why should I give a damn what "some agencies" do? BTW, I have never had a student fail because they could not complete the snorkel and circuit swims, they're really quite easy when you get a little coaching.
 
Walter:
I know at least two that encourage it.

Do they encourage making it mandatory? Back when I came up throught he Y program, the instructor had us do skills above and beyond the base, but said he couldn't withhold certification based on not being able to meet the higer tests, as long as the base skills were met.
 
Thalassamania:
Why should I give a damn what "some agencies" do?

How about YOUR agencies? Do they condone you to failing students solely based on not being able to meet your personal requirements which are above their standards?
 
I am very careful to meet or exceed the standards of any and all agencies I certify through. But trust me, that's not very hard.
 
You also have very careful wording in a lot of your posts to keep things quite vague. ;)
 

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