PADI responded to their OW swim requirement...

[TxHockeyGuy]

I guess many would probably not be happy with my original OW instructor either. There were only 2 of us in the class for the pool portion and he stopped us after we had done about 125 yards or so because he said it was obvious we'd have no problem doing the 200 yards and then some. I was a former competitive swimmer and the other person in the class was a recently retired NFL player who was in great shape so I didn't have a problem with what he did. He did however make us tread water for the full time, which if I recall was 12 or 13 minutes. I certified NAUI so he may very well have been within standards, I don't know.

 

[Scuba Brian]

I agree with you. But is seems clear that this is a rule more honored in the breach than in the observance.

This boils down to a person not wanting to be a tattletale. Unfortunately by their not filing a report they put their students in jeopardy. I have filed two complaints, one on a divemaster, and one on a dive resort. Both were so far out of standards i can't believe they didn't make the Incidents/Accidents forum. Instructors for any agency are supposed to help police that standards are being met and divers are not at risk.

 

[Thalassamania]

I didnt say anything about absolute guidelines. I said, some instructors are not absolute with guidelines, meaning some are lenient and don't have a pass/fail mentality. This is an inherent quality of some human beings and cannot be reversed.

And I suggested that if give them absolute guidelines, (e.g., swim x yard in y minutes without either standing on the bottom or holding on to the side for more than two seconds during each turn). That takes away any leniency and puts into the realm of a clear violation.

 

[ShallowDiverDave]

And I suggested that if give them absolute guidelines, (e.g., swim x yard in y minutes without either standing on the bottom or holding on to the side for more than two seconds during each turn). That takes away any leniency and puts into the realm of a clear violation.

I like that you mentioned to include it in the course material, this seems like a good solution. Maybe having two instructors to witness the tests would decrease the risk of leniency.

 

[Thalassamania]

I guess many would probably not be happy with my original OW instructor either. There were only 2 of us in the class for the pool portion and he stopped us after we had done about 125 yards or so because he said it was obvious we'd have no problem doing the 200 yards and then some. I was a former competitive swimmer and the other person in the class was a recently retired NFL player who was in great shape so I didn't have a problem with what he did. He did however make us tread water for the full time, which if I recall was 12 or 13 minutes. I certified NAUI so he may very well have been within standards, I don't know.

Standards depend on when it happened. But regardless of the agency in that situation I'd favor the Instructor, water people are water people, they're real easy to identify and swim tests exist to do three things, provide students with a clear understanding of what they must be to succeed in the class, set a bar under which the instructor feels that the student is not teachable and give the instructor the chance to make an overall evaluation. I'd never cut a swim test short, but I've never been faced with having just two high caliber swimmers to look at. If your interested in the master of observation, see this post.

 

[Thalassamania]

This boils down to a person not wanting to be a tattletale. Unfortunately by their not filing a report they put their students in jeopardy. I have filed two complaints, one on a divemaster, and one on a dive resort. Both were so far out of standards i can't believe they didn't make the Incidents/Accidents forum. Instructors for any agency are supposed to help police that standards are being met and divers are not at risk.

Screw tattletale, try looking someone in the face and firing them for not meeting standards.

 

[RussR]

I think that the 10 minutes of treading water followed immediately (no break) by a 2 or 3 hundred yard swim is pretty telling. I have been swimming since before I can remember and this "test" was, in my opinion, a good indicator of swimming ability and comfort level.

If any agency set the standards as high as some think there would be very few "recreational" divers.

If people are going to get involved in more dangerous diving then they should have there skills reevaluated but I think this test is sufficent for the OW level - What is done with the results of the test is another story.

 

[Thalassamania]

I think that the 10 minutes of treading water followed immediately (no break) by a 2 or 3 hundred yard swim is pretty telling. I have been swimming since before I can remember and this "test" was, in my opinion, a good indicator of swimming ability and comfort level.

I agree, I can usually find out what I need it that range, but it's nice to see how they tire and how they adjust to the fatigue, there's a lot to be learned there.

If any agency set the standards as high as some think there would be very few "recreational" divers.

And your point is? Frankly I think that this might be a great way for dive shops to fill those unused pool hours, swim lessons!

If people are going to get involved in more dangerous diving then they should have there skills reevaluated but I think this test is sufficent for the OW level - What is done with the results of the test is another story.

I think you are looking at the swim test as a one dimentional binary thing. It's not and it's a shame that dive instructors today are not WSIs as many of us were way back when, there's a whole bunch of data to be had watching someone swim.

 

[O2BBubbleFree]

If you happen to be naturally negative (buoyancy, not attitude), then 10 minutes in deep water is aerobic.

Should be easier for you to do a 10 minute swim the tread. What's the story?

Sorry, I don't understand your question, but would like too...

I said that the swim was no problem, and treading water would not have been a problem, but floating motionless was a problem.

And I think that the instructor's requirement of floating motionless, when the standard specified float or tread water, was a problem.

 

[Thalassamania]

Sorry, I don't understand your question, but would like too...

I said that the swim was no problem, and treading water would not have been a problem, but floating motionless was a problem.

And I think that the instructor's requirement of floating motionless, when the standard specified float or tread water, was a problem.

Sorry, as an ex-sinker I was commiserating with you and remembering that it was easier to swim than to tread. Floating was more like “drown proofing.”