OW Course duration reduced by 25%... opinions?

[Ithilsilmaril]

Hi all,

I was scheduled to begin my NAUI OW course this coming Tuesday but received a call from the shop owner this evening asking if I would be OK with delaying the start of the course by one week, due to only having four students signed up with a couple more thinking about taking it. He wants to give the others more time to make up their minds. I said no problem as my schedule is flexible enough to accomodate shifting the course back a week. He then mentions that this will not affect the end of the course since with fewer students it will go faster (Tues and Thurs 5:30-10pm for 4 weeks originally, now down to 3). So, we are now going from a 36 hour course, which is the main reason I had selected this shop to begin with (I want the most in-depth training that I can find short of GUE Rec 1 which is simply out of budget and too far away at this point) down to a 27 hour course.

I'd like to get opinions, especially from instructors, about this change. How much will this likely affect the quality and depth of the course (taking into account the presumably lower student to instructor ratio)? Does this seem reasonable?

I should also mention that I was originally thinking of taking the May course rather than April (warmer water for the check-out dives!), but found out that they were going to do at least some of the confined water teaching in the local lake for that time frame. I asked about vis and was told 'it can be pretty low'. I then asked if that presented problems for the students and was told something along the lines of 'we do our best to help everyone with it'. That seemed to be introducing unnecessary risk to a basic teaching environment, so I opted for the April class with all CW dives being done in a local pool.

Any and all opinions are welcome.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Quero]

Ask for a breakdown of the schedule as it was at 48 hours and as it is now. You sound like the kind of person who won't need a lot of extra classroom time since you'll actually read carefully and comprehend the background information from your manual. So if the classroom time is where you lose most of those reduced hours, it will probably not affect you at all. If most of the loss is in the in-water modules, then you might 'negotiate' extra pool time as a condition of agreeing to the shortened course schedule. Extra pool time might just be for you to practice on your own, because in fact, if there are very few people in the class, the in-water part of the course does go faster. But it won't hurt you at all and may very well help you to have extra pool time to work on buoyancy, propulsion, and trim.

 

[Peter Guy]

My LDS has a 6 night OW program if there are more than 4 students and 4 sessions if 4 or fewer. While I really prefer teaching the 6 night program, I don't think the 4 night/4 student's get shortchanged that much (of course there is less pool time but more individual instruction). There is a trade off and pool rental is very expensive.

 

[oreocookie]

If the shop owner plans to add the extra week back on at the end if the other two students do sign up or extra pool time is available if you need it, then I don't think you should worry about it. Sometimes a longer class is just to accommodate a slightly larger class size (as Peter's post suggests) since each skill will take longer with each extra person who has to do it. A class that's 25% shorter for a group that's 25% smaller than planned for doesn't sound unreasonable to me.

 

[jIM STEELE]

If you feel good to go at the end of class good, if not I am sure your naui guy will find some more pool time for you maybe in his next class go for it you will love it. I know of a class that has less than 5 hrs of pool (not good)

---------- Post added March 30th, 2013 at 05:56 PM ----------

:cool2:

 

[Ithilsilmaril]

Thanks for the responses- I'll inquire about the class breakdown and whether or not extra pool time is available if it is needed. So far the consensus seems to be that it should pose no major problems so I think I'll probably proceed as planned.

 

[Kitty_Kat]

I think you will find that there will be plenty of time even with the reduced schedule! Speaking from my experience with how we schedule classes, we usually "overbook" the pool and classroom for our classes just in case some unforeseen circumstance comes up. We almost always end pool sessions early (after completing skills and allowing students to have "playtime" to swim around, practice skills, and get comfortable until the point that they start to get bored with it).

27 hours of classroom and pool is by no means a short class either! We do 3 week, 2 week, and weekend express courses with ~28, 24, and 16 hours of class/pool respectively (I'm not including open water time since it didn't appear that your schedule included it). Personally I think the weekend express courses are too short, while the 2 week courses are almost perfect, and the 3 week classes are EXTREMELY slow paced and have hours of extra "just in case" time built in for both pool and classroom.

Definitely give it a shot, and if you do end up feeling rushed, don't be afraid to ask for extra pool time! If your instructor has a problem with it, finish the course with someone else.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Make sure that you are getting all the pool time you need. Remember that one session is going to be rescue skills. And the instructor should have you comfortable enough in the water by the time those are taught that they will be easy to complete. I'd also verify the time of each session. I find that after about two hours the average student has absorbed about all they can and may start to get cold, tired, overloaded, etc.. I'd be leery of any course that did more than four hours a day TOTAL in the pool. My OW classes are six to eight weeks, two nights a week. One night classroom and the other pool. Standards dictate a 32 hour course not including checkouts. And we need that time to get through all the required exercises and classroom material.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

 

[flots am]

I'd like to get opinions, especially from instructors, about this change. How much will this likely affect the quality and depth of the course (taking into account the presumably lower student to instructor ratio)? Does this seem reasonable?

This is really the wrong question for the wrong answer from the shop.

I've had students that were ready for open water in 6 classes (our minimum is 7), however I've also had students who after 8 classes were still mounting the tank backwards and complaining that the hoses were too short.

The real answer is that your class should last "as long as it needs to for you to be properly trained" and nobody including you or the shop owner or anybody on SCUBABoard can tell you how long that will be.

Length of training should be based on your competence in the water, not the shop's calendar.

It's entirely possible for you to be ready within the shop's time limit, but it's also possibe you won't be. You should clarify with the shop owner if you can do additional class/pool sessions at no charge if you (or they) don't think you're ready yet.

flots.

---------- Post added March 31st, 2013 at 10:53 PM ----------

I find that after about two hours the average student has absorbed about all they can and may start to get cold, tired, overloaded, etc..

Yeah, by the time a couple of hours have gone by, everybody is some combination of cold, tired or bored. I'd hate to do 2 hours in the pool, then break for lunch then come back for two more hours. Nobody is going to be happy.

flots.

 

[Ithilsilmaril]

Thanks for the additional insights. Jim and Flots- those replies really seem to have wisdom. I will definitely take a close look at my skills (at least my perception of them) and comfort level in the water at the end of class. If I seem to have a good handle on the skills and knowledge, and the check out dives go well, I'll probably be comfortable to start diving. I will want to have some additional instruction, or at least supervision on my first couple of ocean dives though.

If I feel my skills aren't where they need to be I'll have to talk to the shop and see where they stand on that. If they are willing to give me some more pool time, great. If they are reluctant, I'll have to decide whether to push the issue, or seek additional training elsewhere. There is a more tech oriented shop a couple of hours away with an owner/instructor that really seems to have his head on straight. I want to pursue some training their anyway, so I might be able to pay for a few hours of skills work in their pool.

I *really* would like to foster a good relationship with the local shop, and I have a good rapport with them so far, but I'll have to see how their priorities play out during the class. In any event, I've got another week to study the class materials .