Orientation of first stage manifold.

[WinePlease]

Hi guys, it wasn’t until I moved to a backplate and compact 18 L Wing that I found trouble with fitting everything on the first stage and getting the tank height so that it wasn’t out of trim or bump in my head. Regarding how I’ve got it set up in these photos is there any major risk or consideration around why I shouldn’t set it like this? For context, I’m not doing any technical caving or complicated diving. This is just my regular and travel rig for recreational diving to 30 m, single tank, etc.

As I’m also using 2 other BCDs, this is the only configuration that works for everything. I can get the tank height where I want it and I’m not hitting my head on anything other than the wing when fully inflated which I never have anyway.

 

[happy-diver]

Your perspective is completely unique, I think it's wonderful

 

[ND5342]

One issue I see is laying the tank down opposite the wing could cause damage to the regulator or hose fittings, especially if it is a bumpy ride. I am sure you will get lots of comments from other divers and young DM about the unconventional setup.However in most rec diving this would be fine.

Your cambands are lower than normal on the tank. Most of us put the top cambands just under the crown of the tank. If this causes a trim issue you get pockets to add weight to correct the trim or add weights to the shoulders of your harness. It just takes a couple of pounds usually. And you get it off your waist.

 

[WinePlease]

One issue I see is laying the tank down opposite the wing could cause damage to the regulator or hose fittings, especially if it is a bumpy ride. I am sure you will get lots of comments from other divers and young DM about the unconventional setup.However in most rec diving this would be fine.

Your cambands are lower than normal on the tank. Most of us put the top cambands just under the crown of the tank. If this causes a trim issue you get pockets to add weight to correct the trim or add weights to the shoulders of your harness. It just takes a couple of pounds usually. And you get it off your waist.

Yes that is indeed one consideration that I didn’t initially think about, so when I do let down it will be Harness side down which actually should give some stability from rolling around. I’ll definitely have to watch it. With regards to the tank straps I’m very limited with this setup and I’m quite surprised actually because without getting a single tank adapter which I have coming actually, there is only one way to Oriente the tank straps with the back plate and the wing. There is no flexibility around doing this. To get that top strap up to the shoulder of the tank then the height of the back plate is actually much higher than the tank and there will be stability issues With how it bears up against the wing in the back plate. I think the STA will not only help me offset the tank from the backplate about an inch which might resolve the regulator orientation issue, but it will also allow me to get the straps in the right spot. That being said the way, this is now gives me perfect trim, and I don’t need to go adding weight other than for buoyancy, which I calculate right now is around 3 kg. I’ve got some trim pockets coming which will just help me get weight off the waist belt.

 

[lexvil]

The tank is to high, moving the tank lower won’t change the back plate position.

you shouldn’t be feeling the air cell with you head so you may want to start with dropping the backplate down a bit too.

once the backplate is sitting right use your hand as a guide for tank position, I’m usually 3 fingers from the tank crown to the top strap, after it sits closer you can fine tune it for trim.

in Maldives you can probably get away with the tank backwards like that and not get hung up on anything.

 

[ND5342]

After relooking at your pictures it appears the wing is too high compared to the backplate. Is this an Apeks backplate as well?

Also I see you made a tank shoulder strap for it like a normal BCD. With two cambands That really is unnecessary as with two cambands the tank should not slip out.

 

[WinePlease]

The tank is to high, moving the tank lower won’t change the back plate position.

you shouldn’t be feeling the air cell with you head so you may want to start with dropping the backplate down a bit too.

once the backplate is sitting right use your hand as a guide for tank position, I’m usually 3 fingers from the tank crown to the top strap, after it sits closer you can fine tune it for trim.

in Maldives you can probably get away with the tank backwards like that and not get hung up on anything.

Thanks for the detailed reply. There’s definitely some unique challenges around this wing and back plate because there is only one way you can line up the wing with the backplate and the straps. Once I have the single tank adapter, I will be able to use the alignment a little bit more to resolve How far the wing protrudes from the top of the plate. For now I’m stuck with it the way that it is. I’ve seen another wings. There are some greater flexibility with the tank straps passing through the wing in the back plate, but on this arrangement, it’s stuck. The £18 wing is very slim, but its buoyancy comes from being slightly longer on and taller at the top. as I’ve got the harness and back plate now, I spent a lot of time configuring that for my body shape which is unfortunately quite a short torso. With the way that it is now, I can only just touch the top of the backplate so any lower, it would have a sharp metal edge sitting below my waist, causing discomfort. I’m not fussed about where the straps actually sit on the tank. I know was a guy that should be a bit higher, but if you saw me wearing this, you would understand how I’ve got it the way it is. But that being said the single take adapter will allow me to fine tune Much better than this for now.

 

[WinePlease]

After relooking at your pictures it appears the wing is too high compared to the backplate. Is this an Apeks backplate as well?

Also I see you made a tank shoulder strap for it like a normal BCD. With two cambands That really is unnecessary as with two cambands the tank should not slip out.

Thanks for the reply, yes it is an apex wing and backplate, but the wing is the £18 which is very narrow but quite long. Without a single take it after there is only one way to orientate the wing in the back plate otherwise the tank straps won’t pass through both.. If you’re referring to the white rope, I don’t use that as a safety feature I use that to get the correct height because the grip lock straps open completely so without something to hang on the tank it’s actually quite awkward to do up the straps.

 

[WinePlease]

Some really interesting and useful comments you guys thank you. The one thing I see constantly and it always puzzled me is that I felt that most divers have their tank sitting too low. When I see many divers in the water, this also manifests itself with other problems, such as trim, and therefore people having to add weight in trim pockets up high, grouting of hoses causes jaw fatigue because you’re pulling against, a hose that is rubbing over the top of a BCD and shoulders, etc. I’ve dived with this now and just about every configuration with the first stage front and back up and down and what I learned was that by getting the tank up higher to the point where I could reach the valve and where I could not Kick backwards and touch the bottom of the tank with my heel, not only was I able to more comfortably sit on the bench on the boat with just enough so that the tank took its own weight off my shoulders, but I could just never get around the fact that with the tank up as high as I was having it, I kept hit hitting my head on the first stage. That’s when I thought about rotating it all around the other side. Now I get the tank up exactly where I like it. My trim is perfect and I don’t hit my head. The only concern is that you may need slightly longer hoses, and there is the risk that the first stage is a little more exposed in tight or technical situations, and as somebody pointed out , if it’s on the floor it could get bumped. So I guess the big question is have you all tried diving with your tank a little bit higher to see the impact of that other than bumping ones head on the first stage there maybe other benefits to consider.

 

[Nick_Radov]

It looks like you have the reg attached backwards. If the reg is hitting your head then move the tank down a little. That shouldn't be an issue for trim but if necessary you can move some other weight up to balance it out.

On a ScubaPro Mk20 / Mk25 type first stage, angle it pointing down and slightly to the right. Long hose comes off the bottom end LP port and runs down along the right side of the wing. Backup (necklace) hose comes from the right forward LP port straight over your right shoulder. SPG hose comes off the left HP port. Wing and (if necessary) drysuit inflator hoses come off the left LP ports. If you run an AI transmitter from the right HP port then tie it down to something so that it's not flopping around.