Open Water Fitness Tests

[dmaziuk]

So you get to decide what the standards are for the class? Perhaps you can do that validly....I'd guess most can't, which why they are called standards.

So according to you, when the standard says "200m continuous swim", it's OK for an instructor to interpret that as "200m swim with [brief] stops at the wall to turn around, push off, and go back". It is, however, not OK for the instructor to substitute, say, "ten 50m swims to/from the dive site in full gear" for "300m swim in mask and fins in the pool". Why? My rationale would be that 10x50 swims in gear in open water is a way more realistic test for scuba than either of the other two. What's yours?

 

[TheHuth]

Obviously I am a SCUBA student, but I will provide my 2 cents on this. I am a highly decorated network engineer. To get my certifications, I had to pass very specific criteria. It doesnt matter if I am capable or incapable of doing my job. What matters is I had to prove I was capable of meeting the criteria of my certification.

I agree with dmaziuk that if you can swim with all your gear in open water, you are probably able to safely swim as a diver. However, as I said, being capable/incapable of being safe is not the point. The point is that they have designated a 200m continuous swim as the criteria for obtaining certification. Since that is what they ask, that is what it should be. If some instructors are okay with signing you off without, I would personally question their competence as an instructor.

 

[TMHeimer]

So according to you, when the standard says "200m continuous swim", it's OK for an instructor to interpret that as "200m swim with [brief] stops at the wall to turn around, push off, and go back". It is, however, not OK for the instructor to substitute, say, "ten 50m swims to/from the dive site in full gear" for "300m swim in mask and fins in the pool". Why? My rationale would be that 10x50 swims in gear in open water is a way more realistic test for scuba than either of the other two. What's yours?

Well, if you want to define continuous as never touching a wall or pushing (like "real" swimmers do), then I would think the test would have to be in "confined" open water (calm shallow lake, calm shallow salt water). Otherwise, in a pool that definition of continuous would seem very impractical.
I don't believe the swims are specifically for anything really to do with the mechanics and skills of scuba. Most say they are for determining "comfortability" in water--ei., if your boat sinks and all your scuba gear is gone, including fins and a BC you could orally inflate, you would be able to float for 10 minutes and swim at least 200 meters before you die. It also gets back to the old discussion on whether a scuba candidate must know how to swim--and the definition of what swimming (bathing suit, allowable goggles--not scuba mask) is--with a proper stroke, or getting from here to there anyway you can? Actually, swimming those lengths in full scuba gear basically shows that you are strong enough to kick (properly, not bicycle) on a surface swim, not underwater. Not that this is a bad idea, but it's not the required standard test. Again, defining what the purpose of the swim test is has been debated on SB forever.

 

[tursiops]

TheHuth has it exactly right. It doesn't matter if I know they can swim, or if they can go 500m in full gear. That is not what the standard is.

dmaziuk. you are overthinking "continuous," which means no stops to rest. You keep moving, keep swimming. Turning is part of that.

 

[dmaziuk]

TheHuth has it exactly right. It doesn't matter if I know they can swim, or if they can go 500m in full gear. That is not what the standard is.

dmaziuk. you are overthinking "continuous," which means no stops to rest. You keep moving, keep swimming. Turning is part of that.

No, my point is TheHuth has it exactly right: if the standard spells it out, then meeting the standard means doing it exactly as she's spelt. "Continuous" means uninterrupted. An interruption of a movement would be a zero velocity, such as during a turn.

If, OTOH, you don't take the standard literally, then why is your interpretation not a "violation of standards" while someone else's is?

 

[tursiops]

"Continuous" means uninterrupted. An interruption of a movement would be a zero velocity, such as during a turn.

Please feel free to define "continuous" as you wish. I'll use PADI's definition. If this incredibly semantic point really bothers you, then please call PADI's training department and ask them how the "continuous" swim is to be done in a 25-yard pool.

 

[TMHeimer]

Please feel free to define "continuous" as you wish. I'll use PADI's definition. If this incredibly semantic point really bothers you, then please call PADI's training department and ask them how the "continuous" swim is to be done in a 25-yard pool.

Right. As well, doing a turn would not be "zero velocity"--you're always moving something--unless you stop completely and rest hanging on the pool edge.

 

[dmaziuk]

Please feel free to define "continuous" as you wish. I'll use PADI's definition.

How very apropos.

My definition of "continuous" came from a book called " the dictionary". I never realized PADI was in the business of publishing those.

 

[fjpatrum]

PADI is in the business of defining their own standards, though, and if that means augmenting the dictionary for what "continuous" means from their perspective, then that's what they do.

Yes, technically, any reverse in direction has a zero motion component but the reality is people don't recognize that as a discrete moment in time unless they hang on the side of the pool.

 

[Nemrod]

Actually "real" swimmers do a flip turn that is initiated with a dolphin kick followed by a tuck and a dolphin kick after the reverse. The swimmer does not stop anymore than does a car making a continuous U turn. I can do a flip with or without a push off and in either case the body is moving but the vector is changing.

N