Number of Dives not Quality Count

[Buoyant1]

When did it become such a pi$$ing match? Just dive and stop worrying about HOW many, and just accumulate them. If you doubt your abilities, then dive with people that wil help you learn to be a better diver. If you doubt other's abilities either dive with them to help them, or don't dive with them.

I've done dives with people that have ooodles of experience and I can learn from watching them, and I've done them with people that just learned, and I've almost had to pul them along...or hand them some weight to keep them down etc. I'm just happy because I'm breathing off a reg and not walking around on land.

Just take it where YOU want to take it, and stop worrying about what everyone else does or can do...it's all supposed to be fun, not a tally. Experience is just that...

 

[DennisS]

So my question is inspired by the thread that is polling the average number of dives in a year. I know some great divers who probably average 60 dives a year but on the typical weekend they are diving one or two days, but they are doing technical dives that are deep, and carry a lot of deco obligation. These fellas spending hours underwater every weekend but at the end of the day it's one dive. The water is cold, in the upper 30's and low 40's all year round, it's dark at the bottom.

Deep, cold, crappy viz, deco obligations, we all have different views of what a quality dive is.

 

[AirInHere]

I think the focus on the number of dives a person has is often misplaced.

Certifying agencies use dive numbers to determine if you are a serious diver with a short history of dedication to the sport. They are not intended to be minimums to prevent people from certifying.

Example. You need 20 logged dives to qualify to start the PADI divemaster course. You will need 60 to graduate the course and become a divemaster. That means you have to have been diving long enough to have twenty dives under your belt. Figure three dives average per day and you are at seven days of dedicated diving. Seven days is about four weekends of diving.

So 20 logged dives should be about a month of frequent recreational diving.

Another forty dives gets you to sixty total dives. So logically, two more months to graduate the divemaster course.

And then another forty for Instructor. (Two more months).

So, by my (albeit shoddy) math, a divemaster could be certified at about three months and an OWSI could be certified after five months. All the while diving every weekend all day Saturday and all day Sunday.

This does not mean the diver has any great wealth of experience to draw from, it just shows the person has a dedication to the sport and has made it a regular part of their life and the primary recreational activity for the last half year.

Dive numbers do count, but not just for the sheer numbers. You have to understand what they represent.

 

[DOkie]

Maybe I'm reading the original question the wrong way but I don't think you can assess anyones's diving based upon cold, dark, deep, bottom time, etc. To do so just invokes a cold water vs. warm water and tech vs. rec debate. With the exception of 1 trip per year, I exclusively dive cold, dark, deep, etc.... Does this qualify me to make my dive count as anything more than say an ocean diver would? Not at all. I think us cold water divers have a tendency to think that we are "the ultimate in diving" and all other (warm) just can't measure up. Personally, my hats off to anyone who exclusively dives as part of the food chain.... (grin). Each area has it's own plusses and drawbacks and if you're a diver, it's just a matter of geography - meaning if I lived in Florida, I'd be a warm water diver but that wouldn't make me less of a diver than I am here...

As far as tec vs. rec... In experiencing both, again, they each have their advantages and disadvantages (hmmm... hanging on deco stops or sitting on the boat warming up eating a sandwich getting ready to go back in...) but what is it about being a tech diver that makes a person a better diver? And why should a tec diver be labled a better diver than a rec diver?

You can't define a diver based upon what you think they're experience is. A diver defines themself. (Outside of my buddy - I couldn't care less what anyone thinks of my capabilites).
I dive because I love to dive. As far as the mother sitting on the bottom playing tic-tac-toe? I can't judge. All I can say is that the kids got a memory of playing tic-tac-toe under water and I hope that they have a good/safe vacation.

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

I think when you hit 5000, you become a true dive stud.

Is that 5000 logged dives, or 5000 we don't need no stinking log books dives?

 

[SPG3K]

I honestly think it's ludicrous to evaluate the quality of someone's dives based on the clarity or temperature of the water.

Sure it takes a lot more skill at buoyancy to be neutral with no reference points, but at the same time, who cares? In 2' viz water, your basically there to "log" a dive anyways, unless you are working on something or performing a job/task.

Sure, tech diving requires more knowledge and more experience, but at the end of the day, tech diving is still diving. You descend, go look at something or do something, ascend (with stops, etc.) and do it all over again.

A Caribbean diver does the exact same thing. And they have to stay off the reef using buoyancy control the same way a techie has to stay off the bottom to avoid silt/sand/etc.

A good diver that practices and is trained properly will be equally as skilled and trim, etc, in the water on a tech dive as they will be on a 60' reef dive.

The holier than thou I've seen already from tech divers in my area is ridiculous. If being at 185 feet with pitch blackness and an HID light is your bag, I'm truly happy for you.

However, for me, thats a boring, pointless, and time consuming dive that I would do just for a "number" in a log book if I was trained properly. Those type of dives are simply not the reason I got into diving.

We all know that tech diving is the "next level." But that doesn't mean that people who spend their time above 100' are somehow lacking in the "Quality" column because their dives didn't require deco stops and travel gas and trimix.

 

[SandCrawler]

10 years ago, I was active and felt pretty experienced for the type of diving I was doing. I had five years under my belt, but felt confident. I just re-entered the water this past Saturday after a 6 year break and felt like a beginner again (at least for a few moments anyway). Point is, I could foolishly brag that I've been diving for 15 years, or I could be more realistic and recognize I need to start back with the basics again. Never mind how many dives I've logged. I've got more than some, but a lot less than others.

As previously stated, it is all relative. Frankly, some of the most challenging diving I've done has been at only 20 feet, 1-2ft vis, "rip your mask off" current, at night, sticking flounder. And some of my most relaxing dives have been in excess of 90 feet. IMAO, a totally different skill set is required for each activity.

I believe that it's not how many dives you have, but how many of a particular type of dive you have.

One other point... I agree a log book is for your own good. After 6 years, I was really glad I could review my past dives and refresh my memory on things like weight, exposure, etc.

 

[SparticleBrane]

I think when you hit 5000, you become a true dive stud.

At least that is what I have been told via a PM LOL

Did the diver in question really really love talking about diving history?

 

[Blackwood]

Sure it takes a lot more skill at buoyancy to be neutral with no reference points, but at the same time, who cares? In 2' viz water, your basically there to "log" a dive anyways, unless you are working on something or performing a job/task.

I dive to dive, not to log entries. The environment is what it is. I'll stay out if it's full of nastiness. But cold or dark or murky? If the viz is 2 feet, the viz is 2 feet. I'm still diving, and not for the 'pleasure' of fighting with a five year old dive computer that that my PC thinks is turned off due USB drivers that are questionable at best (i.e. logging).

 

[Scott]

When I look back I draw the conclusion I hope we all draw, and that's the only way you can assess someones diving ability is by talking with them and figuring out what they know, and then more importantly getting in the water with them to see if they can back up their knowledge with their ability.

If your going to be judgmental of ones ability I think you need to take that a step further. Once you know their ability you should decide if you are going to add to their ability or learn from their ability. If not what's the point?