Newbie tank questions

[Hippie Dan]

Hi everone, I need some tank questions answered by all you guys that are up on all the current equipment.I'm gonna work my way through all the forums that pertain to me and ask advice on everything;as I'm just getting back into diving. I have my old rockets, and I can choose from serval nice us divers/scubapro backpacks, but a tank is my first piece that I want to be brand new. So I'll ask some things and see where that takes me. Do I want AL or Steel? Are the 169 buck ones from lieasurepro ok. Std 80 AL.tank. I'm pretty sure. I'd need to know what is the best valve to use.Does that make a difference what reg. can be used with a certain valve.(I got recomended the cressi x52/ac2). I can get my tanks filled at my local shop and there are two other dive shops in northern michigan that I could use if I needed air when we were out their way. I suppose some will think I'm into vintage diving,but I just don't want to use a BC device unless I have to,a weight belt is next after I get a tank. I 'm gonna rent a BC for all my classes, then decide if/when I need /want one. From my first post that got me here, I Know I'll get the skinny on the right tank. Thanks, Dan

 

[Chugwhump]

Backpack?
Holy crap.
You belong in the "Vintage diving forum".

OK....
But seriously,
Aluminum and steel are both good.
Advise us on where and when you will have your tanks with you.
I see you are in Michigan.
And that's about it.

Chug
Thinks aluminum is only for beer cans.
Generally.

 

[herman]

You will get handed a lot of BS on tanks. Many will tell you that steels are the only way to go and for some thats true but there is another side to it. Steels (new) tend to be 2x the price of aluminum tanks. IF you need extra weight then they are nice because they reduce them amount of lead you have to carry but considering the cost of lead vs the extra cost of steel tanks it really does not make much sence to use them just of the weight difference. Some like myself, can not dive (well will not- I "can") steels a lot of the time, the tanks in and of itself overweights me on a lot of the diving I do. Esp if you need more than one, you can get 2 new ALs for about the price of 1 steel...more or less. Used steel 72s like the ones you used back in the day on the other hand can be gotten for a song a lot of times and they are great tanks. Nothing wrong with used AL tanks either as long as they are post 1990.

 

[Nemrod]

Good old steel 72s are the best bet for zero BC diving (and any diving). The next best tanks for zero BC diving, this will cause a fuss, and I mean relatively moderate exposure protection to sink, the plain old aluminum 80 and even better, aluminum 63 cf tanks.

In many cases, it makes sense to use very negative, steel tanks to eliminate the need to carry a lot of lead in your weight belt and the buoyant steel 72, aluminum 63/80 are not helpful there. But we are no talking, it seems, no BC. That is a different game. Now we want to have ditchable weight if needed on the surface to become buoyant and apply the skills once taught long ago, how to rig for an average neutral buoyancy over a dive.

You are not going to find any help for zero BC diving outside of us Minimalist divers and the Vintage Clan. The rest will be totally clueless. I do not think you have figured this out yet.

You mention "best" sometimes, best tank, best regulator. Here is another thing, there is no best. Best for me is not best for somebody else. This is best IMO:

I do not dive a poodle jacket, I either do not use a BC or I dive a back inflate unit which nowadays is called a BP/wing (back plate and wing). Here is Herman:

AWAP ascending into the light:

Mr. Couv having a bad hair day :

N, tie dyed

 

[NAM001]

Hipppie\

\First i think you need to tell us what you are diving now IE al80 12# lead in weight belt with a poodle jacket bcd. A lot of what is best for you involves bouyancy. Now if the above was true. than i would say that you culd go to a steel tank and dump about 4# of lead on the floor. Then go to a BP/W and drop perhaps another 5 or so depending on al or steel plate. Then you only have say 4# on a belt. If the above were true but you have 2# in a belt then steel tanks would not do much for you let alone the a steel bp/w cause you would be too heavy to hold safety stop. I and many others prefer BP/W rigs and many others prefer jackets. There are pro's adn con's to both. Which ever way you go dont make a decision on what the dealer has on the shelf. I would guess that an al BP and a steel bp with a 28-32# single donut wing will last you a life time. Its expensive buying over and over again...... Mostly a tank valve is a tank valve is a tank valve. I would recommend you get a pro valve. That is a valve that is a din valve with a yolk insert in it so it can be used with both din and yolk regulators. I dive H valves so i need 2 regs on my set up. That also is a debatable configuration depending on who you ask. Google for huron tank specs and you will find an array of tanks and thier weights and other usefull stuf. Before you buy a tank you need to now if you can reach/operate your valves and be able to achieve good trim in the water. This is important when youare loooking at say a LP95 tank which is short and heavy and a s-80 which is a taller and lighter tank. You want to be neutral at 20 ft with no air in the wing or bcd and hold depth with say 500 psi in the tank. Hopefully you can see that so far no one can tell you what is the best tank for you would be without some info to work from. As far as a BC device i dont think you are going to get around it. Its just the norm now adays. Your bc may be able to be a 18# if youare lucky, but remember you need the bouyancy to

1. allow our gear to float in the water with you not wearing it.
2. while ou are wearing it it has to hold you and your gear with full tank on the surface with your head out of the water. ( your head is about 10# of
lift)
3. will have to have enough to hold you and a buddy on the surface if his bc or wing fails. That is how i get to about a 28-32 lift device.

The more wet sut you have the less you need for lift but the more lead you have to put on or substitute tank and BP components between steel and al.

Hope this helps a little to formulate our questions.

 

[Nemrod]

Hipppie\

\First i think you need to tell us what you are diving now IE al80 12# lead in weight belt with a poodle jacket bcd. A lot of what is best for you involves bouyancy. Now if the above was true. than i would say that you culd go to a steel tank and dump about 4# of lead on the floor. Then go to a BP/W and drop perhaps another 5 or so depending on al or steel plate. Then you only have say 4# on a belt. If the above were true but you have 2# in a belt then steel tanks would not do much for you let alone the a steel bp/w cause you would be too heavy to hold safety stop. I and many others prefer BP/W rigs and many others prefer jackets. There are pro's adn con's to both. Which ever way you go dont make a decision on what the dealer has on the shelf. I would guess that an al BP and a steel bp with a 28-32# single donut wing will last you a life time. Its expensive buying over and over again...... Mostly a tank valve is a tank valve is a tank valve. I would recommend you get a pro valve. That is a valve that is a din valve with a yolk insert in it so it can be used with both din and yolk regulators. I dive H valves so i need 2 regs on my set up. That also is a debatable configuration depending on who you ask. Google for huron tank specs and you will find an array of tanks and thier weights and other usefull stuf. Before you buy a tank you need to now if you can reach/operate your valves and be able to achieve good trim in the water. This is important when youare loooking at say a LP95 tank which is short and heavy and a s-80 which is a taller and lighter tank. You want to be neutral at 20 ft with no air in the wing or bcd and hold depth with say 500 psi in the tank. Hopefully you can see that so far no one can tell you what is the best tank for you would be without some info to work from. As far as a BC device i dont think you are going to get around it. Its just the norm now adays. Your bc may be able to be a 18# if youare lucky, but remember you need the bouyancy to

1. allow our gear to float in the water with you not wearing it.
2. while ou are wearing it it has to hold you and your gear with full tank on the surface with your head out of the water. ( your head is about 10# of
lift)
3. will have to have enough to hold you and a buddy on the surface if his bc or wing fails. That is how i get to about a 28-32 lift device.

The more wet sut you have the less you need for lift but the more lead you have to put on or substitute tank and BP components between steel and al.

Hope this helps a little to formulate our questions.

This is a carry over thread. The fellow is new to SB and started several threads. Here is the deal, he is NOT diving now. He last dove if I recall circa 1972 before there were BCs and before there were spgs in common use. He is trying to reconcile what he thinks he remembers with what he thinks is the way it is now and is somewhat lost in the nether world betwixt then and now.

N

 

[Hippie Dan]

Man, you guys got all the answers, just what I was looking for.With all the new inovations, and for the safty reasons(that I never thought of),and the ease/oppertunities a bc offers,I bought a Scubapro Pilot BC today. -uck renting one for class. So now that I'm happy with that desecion(getting over my thick head) I need to know if the tank info still holds? Will call seaquatics and see if they have any steel tanks. Are ALs all the same? those 169.00 ones OK? What about these tank weights I see now;yea/nay? Thanks for you time guys, Dan

 

[tplyons]

Man, you guys got all the answers, just what I was looking for.With all the new inovations, and for the safty reasons(that I never thought of),and the ease/oppertunities a bc offers,I bought a Scubapro Pilot BC today. -uck renting one for class. So now that I'm happy with that desecion(getting over my thick head) I need to know if the tank info still holds? Will call seaquatics and see if they have any steel tanks. Are ALs all the same? those 169.00 ones OK? What about these tank weights I see now;yea/nay? Thanks for you time guys, Dan

The $169 ones are fine, but you'll need to spend another $20-30 to have them inspected at your local dive shop. Instead, ask about pricing from your LDS... I know many people who spent more money trying to save by buying off the internet.

However, since I bought my Steel 100's, my AL80's sit around the shop so I can test regs and blow off bits of dust.

 

[Hippie Dan]

Thanks TP, didn't get to call seaquatics today,will try tomorrow. Everything that everyone has helped me with leans towards using steels,Less weight on your person. Will persue that avenue,my LDS,craigslst,ebay,etc. Is a new valve the way to go on an old tank? I'm sure I'll have many more questions,bear with me.Dan

 

[GDI]

message sent let talk