Need to learn about full face masks...

[Externet]

Hi all.
Never tried one, and am after a used one just for experimenting on communications.
Does any standard regulator without the bitepiece fits in, or takes something special ?
Do they exist in silicone (preferably clear) ? The rubber ones from the seventies deteriorated too fast.
Are microphones built-in, are they an option, are microphones tailored only to such and such brand/model mask ?
What about connectors for microphones; are they available as spare/replacement at a store you know ?
If a microphone is an option to be installed, do you know a vendor ?
What could be a cheap price for an used one ?
Any brands you may not recommend ?
And any other clues from your expertise are welcome. Thank you.

 

[tbone1004]

1. depends on the mask. Most are designed for use with a specific regulator, many will require a custom IP *OTS/Poseidon* to function on your first stage so they have to be tuned together. Few will come with a first stage
2. You don't want clear, but most are Silicone
3. option on all. Buddy phone is the best, expect to spend more on the comm system than you will on the mask
4. you shouldn't need to replace them. While they are usually wet connects, they shouldn't need replacing. If they do, will require service by MFG.
5. see above, buddy phone
6. highly unlikely, they will occasionally come up for sale for around $1k used.
7. OTS Guardian and the Poseidon Atmosphere are the only two I'd seriously look at, wouldn't bother with the others

You don't need positive pressure, but it's not bad to have, it helps to defog the lens. I like an inline shutoff with an OPV on the first stage so I can stop the leaky valve while at the surface. I highly recommend an ABV which is the valve on the side of the mask. Allows you to leave the mask on and breathe/communicate while at the surface without using air.

 

[Externet]

Thanks.
I do not need the electronics, nor a ready off the shelf system. Just the mask and a 'replacement' microphone.

Is this garbage for experimenting ?
Rubber? ----> New Black Full Face Mask Black Rubber Cold Water Scuba Diving Warm Mask Nice | eBay
Silicone? ----> Ist Full Face Black Silicone Scuba Diving Mask for Cold Grimey Water | eBay

Seems to accept a standard regulator... and well under $1K, new. The microphone is an additional story still to clear...

 

[tbone1004]

not trying to be combative, just a bit over tired.

What do you believe is a "replacement microphone"? All microphones require electronics to convert sound to an electric signal, then back to sound. Your options are either to be tethered, in which case you may as well be on a hookah system, or you have to communicate wirelessly and the equipment to do that is not cheap for both broadcast and receive. You also need an earphone to return communications. For the mic you either need an auto system that acknowledges when you are trying to speak and communicates back, or you need a push to talk system, otherwise you will eat thru batteries by transmitting constantly, and whomever is listening will hate you for transmitting Darth Vader noises the whole time.

Neither of those masks are designed for speech, nor can they be fitted with com systems to my knowledge unless you design it yourself as part of the breathing adapter, will require a significant amount of custom machining. That mask design will leak if you try to speak or you better be a ventriloquist so you don't have to move your jaw.

 

[Externet]

Thanks.
I understand your view, very well. Those in the link are not for proper speech use. Will check alternatives, as this, can be used with 'standard' mask :
----> http://casanovasadventures.com/catalog/dive/mouth+mask2.jpg

Am after a microphone alone; got the electronics.

Seems found candidates :
----> Amron International Model 1501-011 Replacement Dynamic Microphone with 18AWG Cable Leads and Terminals
----> http://casanovasadventures.com/catalog/dive/KM+EMA.jpg

Will see...
Edited, added attachment.

 

[decompression]

Im only really familiar with the oceanreef and OTS FFM's,

OCEAN REEF INC. | Connecting Divers | Integraded Diving Masks and Underwater Communications
Ocean Technology Systems

But have a look on their websites as they have a lot of useful info.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[manni-yunk]

OTS Guardian and buddy phone are probably the best. I have a few hundred dives with this combo and I loved them. If I ever got past the complexities of multiple gas switches with one - I would still be using it on every dive.

 

[kwinter]

There are plenty of other masks to consider including the Nova/Panorama and the KM Supermask. All FFM have advantages and disadvantages. I have both Interspiro Diveator (AGA) and Guardian masks. I have used them with open circuit and with CCR. I have also used one of the old Scubapro/IST style ones that you linked to on eBay. They provide a little of the advantage of FFM to an extent, namely the capacity to breathe if unconscious, but are really no comparison to a well designed full system.

One of the biggest advantages I always found was to have the comms available. Some systems do not facilitate this well if they require a bite piece. And I assume your question about a replacement microphone relates to a completely different issue and not the purchase of your own mask. The most important thing to remember about the microphone and comms is that if you remove the mask or it floods, do not descend more than 10 feet. Once the mic is wet, it will blow if the pressure increases.

I disagree a little with tbone's price estimate. You can find used AGA and Guardian masks occasionally for well under $1K including Buddy Phones.

OTS Guardian and buddy phone are probably the best. I have a few hundred dives with this combo and I loved them. If I ever got past the complexities of multiple gas switches with one - I would still be using it on every dive.

I used my FFM with gas switching for years. A manifold block, ball valve, and a couple of Omniswivel QDs is all it needs. Call me if your serious. Or maybe invite me on the Dragon now that the rebreather seems to be working.

---------- Post added September 2nd, 2015 at 10:53 AM ----------

Spotted this morning on Facebook. A pair of Guardian masks with comms for $1600. And he says he would sell them separately.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10206396281498949&set=pcb.387780671419650&type=1&theater

 

[manni-yunk]

There are plenty of other masks to consider including the Nova/Panorama and the KM Supermask. All FFM have advantages and disadvantages. I have both Interspiro Diveator (AGA) and Guardian masks. I have used them with open circuit and with CCR. I have also used one of the old Scubapro/IST style ones that you linked to on eBay. They provide a little of the advantage of FFM to an extent, namely the capacity to breathe if unconscious, but are really no comparison to a well designed full system.

One of the biggest advantages I always found was to have the comms available. Some systems do not facilitate this well if they require a bite piece. And I assume your question about a replacement microphone relates to a completely different issue and not the purchase of your own mask. The most important thing to remember about the microphone and comms is that if you remove the mask or it floods, do not descend more than 10 feet. Once the mic is wet, it will blow if the pressure increases.

I disagree a little with tbone's price estimate. You can find used AGA and Guardian masks occasionally for well under $1K including Buddy Phones.




I used my FFM with gas switching for years. A manifold block, ball valve, and a couple of Omniswivel QDs is all it needs. Call me if your serious. Or maybe invite me on the Dragon now that the rebreather seems to be working.

---------- Post added September 2nd, 2015 at 10:53 AM ----------

Spotted this morning on Facebook. A pair of Guardian masks with comms for $1600. And he says he would sell them separately.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10206396281498949&set=pcb.387780671419650&type=1&theater

Ken-

We had a series of back to back gas switch failures with manifolds, etc. We tried a generic one then Omniswivel. After the second or third time in a few weeks, we decided to go more mainstream and use the FFM on dives that we needed the comms - and standard mask and second stages for the rest.

We might break out the FFMs for some of the digging projects and some of the projects on the DC - but at this point I need to get both second stages serviced.

 

[kwinter]

Sean -

I'm a Guardian tech if you want to get your masks to me for service. Cost would be parts, beer, and a ride on the boat.

I'm not sure what kind of failures you had. Were you using a ball valve or shutoffs? The generic Chinese made gas switching valve is junk and not worth saving a few bucks. The Omni is solid but expensive. I have also rigged it up with a Swagelok 3-way valve and with shutoffs. I never had a problem other than the size of some of those solutions. It was especially easy on OC. I could switch an unlimited number of gasses.