MX-10 vs MotorMarine IIex questions

[Texass]

I'm looking at upgrading my camera equipment and I'm having a hard time making my decision. Should I get the MX-10 w/YS-40 strobe and wide angle lens + lens caddy or the MMIIex w/YS-60 strobe without the wide angle lens. Both setups are priced about the same - $700 for the MX10 & $800 for the MMII. To get the wide angle lens for the MMII is another $300 which puts it out of my price range for now.

I want the wide-angle lens since I prefer scenery and buddy shots over close-ups. Maybe this is a misconception on my part, but I figure it will let me get closer and still capture a larger area. I figure that if I get the MMII, I could beg Santa for the lens if it's worth the wait.

A few thoughts I've had is that the MX10 doesn't have the optical viewfinder so I'm not sure if that would make framing harder with the wide-angle lens. Also the MMII has a built in close-up lens if I do want to shoot small stuff. And given the price difference I suspect the MMII probably takes better photos.

In a nutshell, I'd like to know is the MMIIex camera really that much better than the MX-10?

Thanks

 

[joewr]

Hi, Texass!

First, if I help you, will you guys ease up on the natural gas prices for California this Winter?

Second, do you trust a Nikonos owner/user to answer your question?

Third, do you really like Lone Star beer?

Okay, I think you answered all those questions appropriately, so I will procede.

First and absolutely foremost: the wide angle lens is a must! The increased depth of field makes for much better u/w photos. With either camera, in my opinion, you will, after seeing the results, end up using the 20mm more than the 32mm of the mx-10 or the 35mm of the mmII-ex.

Second, the stobe on the mmII-ex, because it is farther off center, can be put at the end of a longer arm, or can be used whilst not attached to the camera tray will help minimize backscatter; you can also illuminate subjects from angles other than straight on or from angles that a fixed strobe cannot. If you are trying to photograph a creature under rock or in coral, this can be critical.

Third, the availability of the 16mm lens for the mmII-ex, could become very important to you as you do more photography.

By now, you are probably wondering how it will feel to live out of a shopping cart just so you can afford an u/w camera!
But if you can bear with me for a few more minutes, I will get to the end.

The MX-10 is a camera that you can enjoy and use to take very good photos. But it is very limited in growth potential compared to the MMII-ex. Putting it another way, you can easily outgrow the MX-10 if you become an avid photographer. The MMII-ex gives you a lot more potential for growth.

Is it worth it? Here is where you need to pull up your shirt and examine your soul--if you keep it under your shirt. What do you want out of your camera? Photos for the album that will be fine memories of your dives--or do you want the capability to expand beyond that to more demanding and more artistic photos? The MMII-ex will be more likely to do the latter for you.

Now, I have gone way out on a limb here and actually expressed an opinion in no uncertain terms...so you better duck when you hear the incomings!

Joewr (never to be confused with Cathy or Jim Church)

 

[TexasMike]

Actually, Joe, you have helped me as well. I too am in the hunt for a good camera, and have looked at the Motor Marine vs. the Reefmaster Pro, which your argument applies to.

Now to just save up my pennies....

 

[herman]

I have an MX-10 and it is a solid camera BUT, it I were to do it again and know what I know now, I would get the MM-II. Basically, due to the better strobes, more film types and lens. I am at the stage where I would like to do some more serious work (macro for me) but unless I sell the MX-10 and buy another camera I really am limited. The MX-10 does have a macro lens avalible but it's not really what I want. Considering the loss I would take on the MX-10 and that I don't get more than a couple times a year to use it, I am kind of "stuck" with the MX-10.

 

[joewr]

Herman (Texas(s)(Mike), you do not have to look if you do not want to),

There are so many ways to spend money when you get into u/w photography! It can be more expensive than scuba equipment. I agonized over what camera to get and settled on the Nikonos because it was so damn versatile. Although Nikon has stopped its own development of accessories, Sea & Sea continues to offer wonderful accessories for the Nikonos. I actually prefer their extension tube set-up over Nikon's.

One more thing: the lenses that you change underwater will never equal the performance of the non-changeable lenses. So, if you ever want to do really large enlargements and, especially, if you need to crop, the Nikonos system would be better.

I guess my message is, enjoy your MX-10, get lots of practice, save your shekels a little longer and get a Nikonos. (Now, someone is, no doubt, going to pop in here and raise the issue of housed cameras. But, now we are talking about a whole different income tax bracket--for the same quality lenses, etc. as a Nikonos).

Oh yeah, Herman, how are you? We haven't "talked" in a while!

Joewr (Still wondering where the hell Iguana Don is?)

 

[SubMariner]

How about a 3rd alternative? Motomarine II?

Yes, they no longer in production, but you CAN get good used or never-been-owned units that will fufill your needs nicely. Especially PRICEWISE!

MMII will allow you to set the apeture and the distance. However, unlike the MMIIex, there is no ability to set film speed; it's all 100 ASA.

MMII, like MMIIex is a much more expandable system than the MX10. It is a much more flexible system, especially for people who are just starting out in u/w photog. And even for those who are more experienced.... I have seen some shots taken with MMIIs that are every bit as good as ones taken with housed SLRs costing thousands of dollars more.

Just my $0.02's worth,

~SubMariner~

 

[Dee]

I agree with Joewr's first post. I started with a MX-10 and quickly outgrew it. I've enjoyed my MMIIEX immensely. One feature that I do like and use often is the ability to change lenses underwater. With a little practice in resetting your camera, you'll never miss another shot.

"They" say the optical quality isn't as good as Nikonos, especially for enlargements, but if there's a difference, it's negligiable to the eye. I've made 11x14 enlargements from slide film that are very clear and precise. Maybe this is just a matter of opinion but I'm very pleased with the results.

IMO, go with the MMIIEX and get comfortable with the 35mm lens while you're waiting on Santa or bring that 20mm! And yes, you'll end up using the 20mm more than anything else. Close-up wide angle shots and macros are my favorites.

 

[joewr]

beauty is in the eyes of the beholder! And you are absolutely correct, but if you were to compare two greatly enlarged shots, one with the changeable lens and one with the Nikkor or Sea and Sea "fixed" lens you would see a difference. Physics and optics are on my side here.

But, if you will look back at my original statement, you will see that I used the word, "crop". The C-word. Most photographers want to use the whole negative because they get the best quality print that way. Unfortunately, we mere mortals sometimes get things in the photo that we do not want--a casual diver swimming by, an unwanted fish intruding in, an Underwater MacDonald's Hamburger sign, etc. So, when we print, we would like to eliminate the distraction. That is really when the quality of the lens becomes paramount! That salt water between the lenses is just no subsitute for the optical glass in a "fixed" lens.

Now, it comes down to dollars!!!!!!

Dive with the best! Join the SSN (a word from our sponsor)

Joewr

 

[Dee]

I've never had the opportunity to compare the two enlargements side by side. I'm not saying there's absolutely no difference, I'll defer to the science of Physics and Optics, just that I'm very satisfied with the enlargements I get with my set-up. And yea, cropping can make all the difference in the world.

It always comes down to dollars, eh?? Another reason for the S&S MMIIex. IF I could do more diving in clear waters, IF I could take more than 2-3 trips a year, IF I could justify the expense...I'd have a fixed lens set-ep, or a housed system or be going totally digital.

 

[joewr]

Dee,

The nice thing about photos on the wall: you do not have to compare them to anything else!

Yep, good old $$$$.

Which reminds me of one of my favorite sayings: If frogs had wings, they wouldn't bump their butts when they jumped. I always think of that if I say somelike, "If I were Bill Gates,......"

Well, my grandson is here--I am content. Now, let's spoil him rotten (That's a granpa's job!)

Joewr