Mt Storm accident questions

[JayJudge]

Hi,
I am working on my DM, and the mapping, dive planning and whatnot has to be based on Storm. Let me be honest, I have dove there many times as that is the only place the instructor I am using ever goes for training- oh and Bonaire- so we'll just leave him out of this. This means quiet JR. :no Having been there a few more times than I want, I have a few complaints, especially in regards to this as a training site for OW students. It is an altitude dive- the closest chamber is a 2 hr flight- the vis sucks- the silt invites OW's to crawl on the bottom- the entrance is a nightmare, especially when the day has gone on and it turns to mud- there is little cell coverage at the site, leaving emergency help harder to get- the rocks in the enterance have made me fall more that I can count (I am from WV) - and storms rip through while you are at depth-On the plus side it is usually warmer than a quarry, and there are catfish. And a lot of neat people that I've met (Washington Scuba comes to mind-give a shout guys) Now, the whole reason I am posting this is to hear what, if any injuries you have sustained, and use these anonomously in my report. You can PM me too if you want. Like I said this is more about OW students, and their use. My friends and I do use it on our own for dives, but I feel it is a more advanced dive site, especially when you have new divers that have enough problems with gear, trying to climb the cliff in. or go shooting up due to neoprene. Or get lost on their nav dive cause they are more than 2 ft from you.
thanks for any help,
-Jay

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Jay, just saw your post. I'm from WS. It's a little late and my wife wants to go to bed so I'm gonna give you a more detailed post later this weekend. If you want PM me and I'll give you my cell number. It's on verizon and I did my mapping and emergency plan for storm also. Would be happy to discuss it with you. Jim

 

[aquaman_06]

Jay,

Since Mt. Storm is so close to my home I dive there quite a bit. My fiance hates it so much I literally have to beg her to go there. I agree that the entrance alone nearly disqualifies it as an OW training ground. I know my first expierence there I found navigating and moving with my gear on hard enough so climbing down the cliff and hopping over rocks was very tough. Several divers in my OW course tripped and fell, luckily no-one was severly hurt but it could have happened.

Viz at Mt. Storm, I agree, sucks royally. The best viz I had there was last weekend and even at that it might have been 15 feet at best. Below 50 feet viz was nothing.

All in all I like Mt. Storm simply because when its winter out I can go there and dive and the water temp is alright, but other than that it is a bit tricky.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

As promised here I am back. To some extent I agree about Storm perhaps being a little much for some ow students. But from what I have seen it's not so much about the lake itself but about the training people get before they get there. Granted the entrance has gone to crap pretty badly this winter. On new years day I got dumped on my back in a drysuit and lp95 with 20 some pounds of weight on while trying to get in the water. This was due to stepping on a large rock that should not have been where it was. What happens is people come up there to swim, get drunk, fish, and think it's funny to toss rocks around where divers go in. I've seen them do it. Someone did try to put some rudimentary steps in but with the nature of the soil, erosion took it's toll. There have always been issues since I got certed there with entries and exits. It has been discussed a few times about getting some of the shops/ people together and build a good solid set of steps or even better a ramp down to the water with a small platform for entries and exits. The problem here is coordinating it, getting an OK from DNR since the plant turned over management of it to them, and coming up with the funds, labor, and materials. I personally would be willing to donate some cash, time, and labor. I'm going to start diving doubles soon and if I'm gonna do it at storm you can bet I will be going in at the boat ramp and not down over that "cliff".

As to injuries I have heard of several minor ones involving scrapes, falls, and twisted ankles. See the last few posts in the roll call thread on here by Brutus from ohio. I have witnessed people fall backwards, forwards, and sideways with luckily no injuries that they complained of but the chance for injury was real good.

As to the altitude, the lengths of time students are in the water for their dives and the depths involved, it does not really have that great of an effect. Every student of ours ius informed that it is an altitude dive and that when doing it on a regular basis there are special procedures to follow but for 4 ow check out dives there should be no problems. Now when I'm checking out the hole at 127 ft it becomes more of an issue since I'll probably being doing 2 or 3 more dives that day.

As to vis I agree it could be better. I have seen 2 ft and actually 25 ft or better on the same day. It gets dark below 50 ft alot lately but actual vis with my 50W halogen cannister can be pretty good below the wall. I have had real clear stuff below 100 ft alot. For students doing ow or even AOW nav exercises it can be a challenge but also a good learning tool for nav as well as buddy skills which are not taught enough IMO. We do a good job with our students but there is only so much someone can learn in the brief time we have them. Others seem to do it instinctively while some I'm afraid will never get it.

Silt outs can be easily remedied by the instructor taking time BEFORE they get there in the pool and on land to be sure the students are properly weighted. If you have been there half as much as I have you've seen the people who take whatever their instructor gives them for weighting, ask no questions, and do not do a weight check. Just get in, get the skills over with, take em on a plow tour without looking back at who is doing what with their kicks and buoyancy, get em out and leave. Another reason why you see us there all day, early on sunday and taking our time about getting the dives in. Yeah it's about talking things over and making sure everyone knows what's going to happen, gear checks, skill reviews, and pairing people up, but it's also about waiting for the silt from the other classes to clear before getting in. Now we have our share of bottom crawlers but the instructor and us DM's try real hard to correct these people during the dive. It's why our students do not kneel on the platform at the same time but are instructed to hang horizontal on the edges with the DM's keeping an eye out and making needed adjustments until it is that students turn to demo their skills. I would like to see us do more with skill demos in midwater but that is not always possible again given the time we have with them. I have however seen them on their own try to imitate me when I clear a mask while swimming horizontal or hovering that way, clip and unclip lights, etc while hanging next to the platform, trying to do my modified frog kick which I can do less than a foot off the bottom and not distrub anything. Some get it, some don't . The main thing is they try because they have been given an example and encouraged to keep practicing it. I could go on but I'll stop for now. Any other questions feel free to PM me. Jim

 

[JayJudge]

I agree on the fact altitude doesn't come too much into play, aside from ascent rates are more critical. The instructor I am with honestly never checks on his divers, thats where we come in, along with tying in the flag, and a few other things. I am happy to put up money and time, as are the people in my club, to get steps in there. I think if we built them, transfered them and affixed them at night it might work. If anyone can, see if the power people or the DNR would take them down or not. As for the rocks, we can move some of them easily enough, use a bag on some of the others. Clearing out the enterance would be one of the first steps. I, too will be diving doubles up there this year, and I like not being hurt. We also are planning to drop a couple more things in this spring. By the way, anyone ever seen the induction pipes? The map on the net sucks, and a general idea of where they are would be good. We plan on posting our map on our site once that is up and running, and the mapping finished.
-Jay

 

[J.R.K.]

you've seen the people who take whatever their instructor gives them for weighting, ask no questions, and do not do a weight check. Just get in, get the skills over with, take em on a plow tour without looking back at who is doing what with their kicks and buoyancy, get em out and leaveJim

Wow Jay;
That sounds exactly like an instructor we know doesn't it? "ohhhh....somebody's gonna go hungry"
J.R.K.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

You guys gotta come up on Good Friday. We'll have a blast!

 

[JayJudge]

ughhh. I teach (guitar), not sure if I am working that night. Maybe I'll be there-if not you still gonna be there on Sat?

 

[Jim Lapenta]

A firm a tive. Got the ok from the missus to stay til saturday afternoon! Hey cancel the teaching unless you need the cash. Tell em it's a religious thing!

 

[JayJudge]

Well, its not the night of the hot moms, so maybe. Just gotta figure in a Jersey trip too...