Medical Privacy Concern

[NudeDiver]

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/4326284-post2.html

The first post on this thread where your first sentence was "just lie on the form"

Huh uh. And was that in response to someone who "just wanted to do this" ? Or was it my response to someone who said:

It seems to me that having a signed dive release from a doctor and signing a general waiver of responsibility should be enough without having to list all the details.

You also seem to conveniently forget that in that same post, I said:

If you have a concern about a potential issue, there is nothing to keep you from discussing it with your doctor and getting a "release" for your personal records, and keeping it to yourself.

 

[OldNSalty]

I am no expert, the highest level of certification I have is rescue and I took some combat life saver courses in the military. It could be that I have forgotten way to much but I can't really see how knowing rather you are a diabetic or pregnant (or both) might effect in any way the steps I would take to try and restore breathing after you decided to try and breath water. The hospital might need to know this but that's why they have medic alert bracelets.
Furthermore, and no disrespect intended, but DM and instructors aren't even required to have a high school diploma. I know that they have an understanding of diving and health but they really aren't qualified to be reviewing those forms IMO. I know many people will come back and say 'Of course I am qualified; if you tell me you have asthma I will tell you not to dive.' Well, yes and no. You can say that you won't certify someone or that I should speak with my Dr. but your advice really shouldn't be taken over a Dr. or a call to DAN or the individual making an informed decision as to rather they are healthy enough to try SCUBA.
Really, instead of a health questionnaire, they should just have you read and sign a statement that explains that certain medical conditions might make it more dangerous or even impossible for you to dive. Your LDS does not need to know what prescription meds you take unless they want to get licensed by the state to practice medicine.

 

[Diver0001]

Huh uh. And was that in response to someone who "just wanted to do this" ? Or was it my response to someone who said:

Dude, you're back-peddling, which I don't mind at all and I can respect.

The trap is not to just say "I take it back".

Do you still believe that lying on your medical form is a good idea?

R..

 

[Steve02]

There's no grounds to invoke HIPAA here, you're voluntarily releasing your own information to a dive shop/instructor that is not a covered entity under HIPAA.

Remember, the H and I in HIPAA stands for "Health Insurance" and the act covers people who receive payments or reimbursement related to health insurance - health care providers, health plans, and organizations that process healthcare data for healthcare providers or health plans.

I am going to have to contest this. I know of two cases personnally where HIPAA extends far beyond "Health Insurance".

The first case is from my ex-wife. The firm that she was working at, a global engineering firm, held training seminars shortly after HIPAA was passed. These seminars were to discuss, not HIPAA, but all of the personal information security laws that were made under, and as a result of, HIPPA. She told me a few of the things they discussed, and one I'll never forget - as brother-in-law was terminated from his job and they sited this new law as the reason.

My brother-in-law was terminated from his position because he asked one of his co-workers in casual conversation "How was your weekend?"

At work, you aren't even allowed to discuss personal issues, without possible reprocussions - under HIPAA.

Another one that pops into my mind; if you call off sick, unless you volunteer the information, your employer is not ask what is wrong - or for a doctors note; until, if I recall correctly, 3 consecutive days off sick. Then they can ask for a doctors note.

So yes, the HI may stand for Health Insurance, but it goes much deeper than that - ask my brother-in-law.

 

[adurso]

The first and the last cases cited above are pretty close to the case I'm talking about.

I don't plan on following the responses to this post saying "he would have died anyway" or "it was his choice" or "you pay your money, you take your chances" etc as those are absolutely ridiculous. They fact remains that if the guy I'm talking about had not lied on the form he would certainly not have died that day - because he would not have been on that dive. Plain and simple.

Your assertion then is that the act of falsifying the form became proximal as the subject in question would not have then been certified to dive and as such would not have been on a trip where he met his demise.

Temporal is not necessarily causal.

Should not have his condition have been observed during training then?

 

[Steve50]

My brother-in-law was terminated from his position because he asked one of his co-workers in casual conversation "How was your weekend?"

.

Your brother-in-law is better off now.

 

[NudeDiver]

Dude, you're back-peddling, which I don't mind at all and I can respect.

I'm not back peddling in the slightest. You're reading to fit your agenda. That's fine

Do you still believe that lying on your medical form is a good idea?

Of course.

 

[vladimir]

If they are truthful on the form, and that results in the need for physician clearance, and then the physician provides such clearance, there's no problem.

Presumably then, as in the OP's case, if they have medical clearance the information on the form is not necessary to divemasters who, by and large, don't have the medical expertise to act on the information.

Y
We have. One of our divers died during a dive because he had a serious heart ailment and lied about on the medical form because he *really* wanted do this...

Another was prone to panic attacks but lied about it. Without any warning at 25 metres (83 ft) he ripped his mask off, threw out his regulator and breathed water... This one we saved despite his best efforts to the contrary.

Another, one of our own staff members, nearly bit it from a heart ailment on a wreck dive in the middle of the North Sea. He knew he wasn't well but didn't want to hear what the doctor had to say.....

and THAT (the last one) is what the medical form is for. It's forcing people to seriously consider the risks and not to minimize them, hide them, or ignore them.

Presumably the three divers you cite did not have medical clearance to dive with their conditions, as the OP has, or did they? That is a different situation that I think we would all be more in agreement on.

They fact remains that if the guy I'm talking about had not lied on the form he would certainly not have died that day - because he would not have been on that dive. Plain and simple.

Did that guy have medical clearance to dive with his condition, as the OP has?

 

[Riger]

Time out chaps !!!

 

[Diver0001]

Of course.

Ok, then.

I think we've both stated our positions well enough.

I hope the reader decides to be honest with themselves, their doctors and their diving instructors because if it back-fires the result can be drastic, including death, if they aren't.

You hope they lie so they can go diving at any cost.

It doens't look like we're going to bridge that gap so we'll have to let the reader judge these two standpoints for what they're worth.

R..