blue32
Guest
Do you really believe that? If that were true, there would be pot heads all over the country dying of emphysema and lung disease. :rasta:
Marijuana (not while diving)
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Do you really believe that? If that were true, there would be pot heads all over the country dying of emphysema and lung disease. :rasta:
BradfordNC
Contributor
As to the extra damage caused by smoking pot, its one of those trade offs similar to is jumping off a building safer than jumping out of a moving vehicle.
There is no tar in pot, so the smoke scorches the lungs.
Of course, the tar in tobacco coats the lungs in goo.
Which is better???
As for researching pot and diving, have to agree with the Doc, don't realy think anyone is going to fund a study and pay to have people light up and get DCI.
However, if anyone out there is realy interested, there is a way to do it. Simply research past DCI incidents and find out if any of them are pot smokers. Then find out their histories, how often they smoked and so on.
could be some interesting research. Any aspiring students out there in need of a post graduate research project???
There is no tar in pot, so the smoke scorches the lungs.
Of course, the tar in tobacco coats the lungs in goo.
Which is better???
As for researching pot and diving, have to agree with the Doc, don't realy think anyone is going to fund a study and pay to have people light up and get DCI.
However, if anyone out there is realy interested, there is a way to do it. Simply research past DCI incidents and find out if any of them are pot smokers. Then find out their histories, how often they smoked and so on.
could be some interesting research. Any aspiring students out there in need of a post graduate research project???
Dr Deco
Contributor
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Dear Bradford:
Surveys
This method is often used not only in diving but also in many aspects of daily life. Opinion polls are often taken to ascertain the feeling of citizens on a myriad of topics.
To be effective, it is necessary that a large sample be obtained (large is a relative term), and that the response be 100% of the sampled population. If anyone declines to answer a question, you do not really know why, and the accuracy of the study is diminished. :anon:
Since person surveys are difficult and expensive, recourse to made to mail-in polls. The typical problem here is the low rate of returned questionnaires. When these are not returned, you do not know why; possibly someone was reluctant to admit to a problem. Possibly they are in denial or possibly timid. With diving situations, many divers simply do not know if they had joint-pain DCS (the bends) if it was very mild. Alternatively, quite possibly, any ache will be attributed to DCS.:doctor:
Diagnosis
Many divers are really quite unsure (about DCS, that is, not about smoking marijuana). To be certain, a test of pressure is necessary. The means a trip in a recompression chamber to confirm the diagnosis, and this is probably not done in most minor cases. Therefore, we are left with major problems.
General this and that
For example, it has been difficult to determine if recent injury plays a role in decompression problems, because frequently someone will bump an arm or elbow on a dive trip. When later asked about a recent injury, divers will generally reply in the affirmative. A prospective test could be done by giving one half of the test subjects a good whack on the knee prior to decompression. I dare say this would not attract many volunteers.
Since the incidence of DCS is very low in recreational scuba, a big survey would be necessary. Were you high when you were down? Say what?
Dr Deco :doctor:
Surveys
This method is often used not only in diving but also in many aspects of daily life. Opinion polls are often taken to ascertain the feeling of citizens on a myriad of topics.
To be effective, it is necessary that a large sample be obtained (large is a relative term), and that the response be 100% of the sampled population. If anyone declines to answer a question, you do not really know why, and the accuracy of the study is diminished. :anon:
Since person surveys are difficult and expensive, recourse to made to mail-in polls. The typical problem here is the low rate of returned questionnaires. When these are not returned, you do not know why; possibly someone was reluctant to admit to a problem. Possibly they are in denial or possibly timid. With diving situations, many divers simply do not know if they had joint-pain DCS (the bends) if it was very mild. Alternatively, quite possibly, any ache will be attributed to DCS.:doctor:
Diagnosis
Many divers are really quite unsure (about DCS, that is, not about smoking marijuana). To be certain, a test of pressure is necessary. The means a trip in a recompression chamber to confirm the diagnosis, and this is probably not done in most minor cases. Therefore, we are left with major problems.
General this and that
For example, it has been difficult to determine if recent injury plays a role in decompression problems, because frequently someone will bump an arm or elbow on a dive trip. When later asked about a recent injury, divers will generally reply in the affirmative. A prospective test could be done by giving one half of the test subjects a good whack on the knee prior to decompression. I dare say this would not attract many volunteers.
Since the incidence of DCS is very low in recreational scuba, a big survey would be necessary. Were you high when you were down? Say what?
Dr Deco :doctor:
BradfordNC
Contributor
I never said it would be easy.
-BlueHole-
Guest
REEAALLYYY SICKK, I needed 5 min to stop laughing
:drain:
Yah...I can't believe someone would put that much effort into getting it all working - an underwater bong.
I swear - I knew a lot of stoners in college, and they were the most ingenious crew when it came to coming up with something to smoke out of!
I swear - I knew a lot of stoners in college, and they were the most ingenious crew when it came to coming up with something to smoke out of!
had to be, uh, "interesting".
Wonder if she took into account the issues with partial pressure of O2 and the burn rate - that could get rather, uh, interesting at any kind of significant depth.
(No. Do not attempt something stupid like that. Really.)
Wonder if she took into account the issues with partial pressure of O2 and the burn rate - that could get rather, uh, interesting at any kind of significant depth.
(No. Do not attempt something stupid like that. Really.)
If the diving community hasn't figured out that the tropics, diving, and pot go together like a skin tight suit and Brittany Spears... there is a lot of denial going on.
However - we can factually state the following...
First - we don't yet know enough about deco sickness yet.
Second - we don't yet know enough about the various other chemicals in pot besides THC and how they react under pressure.
Third - we do know that studies of drinking and driving vs. smoking pot and driving show that (while it is still dangerous) pot smokers perform better in the car then the drunks, but not better then those not under the influence.
That's the facts about the physiology. Now we can speculate the psycology of the individual...
It would be interesting to study the stress levels of those in emergency circumstances under the influence of pot vs. those that are not.
It would also be interesting to see the effectiveness and clarity of a person's cognition under the influence of pot, then under the influence of narcing and then combined.
I would then compare this study with people who are not pot users and compare the cognitive abilities under the martini law, etc...
As anicdotal evidence I have noticed that many of the people I dive with regularly smoke pot and I have not noticed a lack of capability, perhaps because they are used to working in a diminished capacity; however those who drink... that's another matter. These people actually tend to ignore their buddies during checkout, puke on the boat, etc...
However - we can factually state the following...
First - we don't yet know enough about deco sickness yet.
Second - we don't yet know enough about the various other chemicals in pot besides THC and how they react under pressure.
Third - we do know that studies of drinking and driving vs. smoking pot and driving show that (while it is still dangerous) pot smokers perform better in the car then the drunks, but not better then those not under the influence.
That's the facts about the physiology. Now we can speculate the psycology of the individual...
It would be interesting to study the stress levels of those in emergency circumstances under the influence of pot vs. those that are not.
It would also be interesting to see the effectiveness and clarity of a person's cognition under the influence of pot, then under the influence of narcing and then combined.
I would then compare this study with people who are not pot users and compare the cognitive abilities under the martini law, etc...
As anicdotal evidence I have noticed that many of the people I dive with regularly smoke pot and I have not noticed a lack of capability, perhaps because they are used to working in a diminished capacity; however those who drink... that's another matter. These people actually tend to ignore their buddies during checkout, puke on the boat, etc...
Scuby Dooby
Guest
Keep in mind also that marijuana is an hallucinogen. Most people don't think of it that way because it generally doesn't cause a 'break' with reality like LSD, etc. The usual reason for this is that most people don't find the hallucinogenic effects of cannabis all that fun - paranoia, anxiety, etc. They generally smoke enough to get giggly, mellow, etc. and skip the high doses that bring on the hallucinogenic stuff.
Also keep in mind the effects of nitrogen narcosis in combination with marijuana, or any other 'intoxicator' for that matter. CNS drugs are fairly unpredictable in effect all on their own. When you combine them with other drugs the effects become much more unpredictable. Combing the high of nitrogen narcosis and a drug associated with panic (in many people) in a potentially life threatening situation (scuba diving) doesnt seem to me to be the best idea . . .
Now, the last intention I have is to scare all you 'god fearin' zero tolerance, drug testing americans away from the evil weed! Like anything else, common sense, and everything in moderation :tease:
Also keep in mind the effects of nitrogen narcosis in combination with marijuana, or any other 'intoxicator' for that matter. CNS drugs are fairly unpredictable in effect all on their own. When you combine them with other drugs the effects become much more unpredictable. Combing the high of nitrogen narcosis and a drug associated with panic (in many people) in a potentially life threatening situation (scuba diving) doesnt seem to me to be the best idea . . .
Now, the last intention I have is to scare all you 'god fearin' zero tolerance, drug testing americans away from the evil weed! Like anything else, common sense, and everything in moderation :tease:
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