Leadking
Contributor
There was a day you had to send your tank back to get a refill!
Major Industry Change re: Online Scuba Sales....
- Thread starter PhilEllis
- Start date
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Leadking:
I'll be sad when most of the shops close, however I suspect what will happen is the welding-supply places will do the VIPs and Hydros and air fills, and the manufacturers and a few big mail-order places will do service.
Terry
Gil57usa
Contributor
I have been Diving for some time now. There are certain pieces of equipment I want to see and try before I buy. However, there are other pieces of equipment such as tanks that are substantially less expensive on the internet. In my area, I am fortunate to have several Dive shops to shop at. By the same token, the service provided by all three leaves a lot to be desired. Their retail prices are very much out of line, their service is sometimes questionable and their attitude is that they are doing Divers a favor by being there. Also the cost of training seems high compared to Dive shops in other areas. I am not advocating that the Shops give it all away, however, I do think it would be better for the Customers, the Dive industry, and themselves, if they would be more realistic about Retail compitition and Customer service.
Web Monkey:
In the current economic situation for the dive industry, you don't have to worry about "most" of the shops closing. There are a number of local scuba stores currently operating in markets large enough to sustain them on walk-in sales only. Unfortunately for many, they are located in the larger metro markets. What will happen is that "many" store will close.......possibly as many as 1/3 of them. Some small number in the smaller markets will actually have the skill, finances, and energy to put forth a workable web presence. They will be able to continue to operate.
The fear that the "big boys" will take over the market is a little misleading. This business is so small, they really probably have no interest. There may be some number of experiments like the "gander mountian" venture, where they team with large scuba operations to include scuba in their store. This will require finding existing scuba operations that are large enough to fund such an enterprise. I don't think you should worry much about the "big boys" forming many alliances with the scuba manufacturers directly. Anyway, my opinion.
Phil Ellis
Scared Silly
Contributor
To bring this full circle for those of us who commented on the scuba and ski industry being very similar. Seems the ski industry is making strides to encourage more minorities:
http://www.cnn.com/2006/TRAVEL/10/30/bi.ski.resorts.minorities.ap/index.html
http://www.cnn.com/2006/TRAVEL/10/30/bi.ski.resorts.minorities.ap/index.html
mike_s
Contributor
Web Monkey:
I don't really think that the welding industry stores really want the "retail customer" of the dive industry. They don't want a customer that spends time there asking a bunch of questions. They are more geared towards the "bottle tech" that fills welding bottles 8 hours a day from 7am to 4pm M-F. They want to sell to their regular account customers who are welding shop fabricators, etc.
scubanaked
Registered
Phil,
I was just pointing out that just because it is online does not make it a great deal or even a good one. I do buy items online, but if it close, I prefer to buy it locally..and it just doesn't apply to dive gear...It seems that allot of people are LDS haters....and most from what I have seen, don't have as much knowledge as they think they do...and I am not just talking about dive gear...
I was just pointing out that just because it is online does not make it a great deal or even a good one. I do buy items online, but if it close, I prefer to buy it locally..and it just doesn't apply to dive gear...It seems that allot of people are LDS haters....and most from what I have seen, don't have as much knowledge as they think they do...and I am not just talking about dive gear...
scubanaked
Registered
All of my regs are Sherwood blizzards...you also assume that I have never moved, and don't take into account that I may have bought this equipment over a time period..like 15 years...Why do I need so many regs? I might need a reg for my primary tank, one for my pony bottle, maybe if I dive with a H valve, I might need one for that or just like a spare...I might need two more for my doubles... as far as the Oxycheck they do not carry that brand, but they would get me a dive rite or halcyon...but I have run into to many "doing it right" divers and would not want to be confused with any of them.
SoggyShoes
Registered
We may be really focused on price but a lot of people- including myself- buy a product and choose a retailer for quality and customer service. If you read through the various posts on ScubaBoard it seems that there is as much dissatisfaction over customer service as there is on price. With poor customer service you better be the only available option, compensate with rock bottom prices, or have an endless supply of first time customers to even have a chance at long term success.
Diving for me is a pure hobby and is also partly a social activity (I dont dive solo), so the relationships do count. I have been in dive shops that give the scare tactics and seem to look for the negative in everything they dont sell and even if those shops had the lowest prices I dont trust them and wont use them! When I shop from places like DiveTank or my local shop (Underwater Works) they never tell how I am going to die if I buy from someone else or used equipment. When I bought a used pony and regulator, Underwater Works spent a lot of time helping me set it up and they didnt immediately make much on that service but, since then I have spent over $2000 in their shop and had a few friends go to them for certification.
As I mentioned in an earlier post I buy my home computer parts from a small local shop. The owner has an internet store that I have used a couple of times, but I use him because I trust him, he has good customer service, and fair prices. In the past 5 years I have probably sent 20 people to him for a custom built computer. I cannot think of an industry that has faced more of the pressures from large chain stores and internet sales than home computers. In the age of NewEgg, Frys, and Best Buy his little locally owned shop has boomed. He had to rent the space next to him just for the service techs he had to hire to have a place to work. He now has more work than he can handle and is struggling to keep on top of the growth he is experiencing. There is no way that he is buying the volumes that the big box and large internet stores are buying and he is even competing against manufacturers such as Dell and Gateway, but some how his little business is still booming.
So do I think that there will be a consolidation of the market? Yes. I think from what I read on ScubaBoard and have personally experienced there are a lot of shops that havent figured out that their business is at the mercy of its customers not the other way around. With the internet there is an increase in competition and this will filter out a layer of poor shops. Many shops may close, some may merge; but I think the consolidation will continue to include small independent shops that can find a successful model like Underwater Works and DiveTank regardless of the competition they face.
Couldnt help myself and had to add to the mess.
Soggy
By the way to me good customer service definitely includes a price that feels fair.
Diving for me is a pure hobby and is also partly a social activity (I dont dive solo), so the relationships do count. I have been in dive shops that give the scare tactics and seem to look for the negative in everything they dont sell and even if those shops had the lowest prices I dont trust them and wont use them! When I shop from places like DiveTank or my local shop (Underwater Works) they never tell how I am going to die if I buy from someone else or used equipment. When I bought a used pony and regulator, Underwater Works spent a lot of time helping me set it up and they didnt immediately make much on that service but, since then I have spent over $2000 in their shop and had a few friends go to them for certification.
As I mentioned in an earlier post I buy my home computer parts from a small local shop. The owner has an internet store that I have used a couple of times, but I use him because I trust him, he has good customer service, and fair prices. In the past 5 years I have probably sent 20 people to him for a custom built computer. I cannot think of an industry that has faced more of the pressures from large chain stores and internet sales than home computers. In the age of NewEgg, Frys, and Best Buy his little locally owned shop has boomed. He had to rent the space next to him just for the service techs he had to hire to have a place to work. He now has more work than he can handle and is struggling to keep on top of the growth he is experiencing. There is no way that he is buying the volumes that the big box and large internet stores are buying and he is even competing against manufacturers such as Dell and Gateway, but some how his little business is still booming.
So do I think that there will be a consolidation of the market? Yes. I think from what I read on ScubaBoard and have personally experienced there are a lot of shops that havent figured out that their business is at the mercy of its customers not the other way around. With the internet there is an increase in competition and this will filter out a layer of poor shops. Many shops may close, some may merge; but I think the consolidation will continue to include small independent shops that can find a successful model like Underwater Works and DiveTank regardless of the competition they face.
Couldnt help myself and had to add to the mess.
Soggy
By the way to me good customer service definitely includes a price that feels fair.
scubanaked:
I don't think anyone has suggested that something is a great deal "just because it is online" and many online supporters have said they would prefer to buy locally if their LDS was competitive. But what many of you do not seem to be hearing and comprehending is that many of us do not have an LDS where the price is reasonably close and the LDS has no interest in getting close. We would love to "support the LDS" when the transaction represents good value but we are not writing charity checks out of fear that we won't have any place to get air fills someday. Many of us do not need an LDS to find dive buddies, make friends, get advice, or plan trips.
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