Major Industry Change re: Online Scuba Sales....

[Midnight Star]

For me, I hope it does work out since I don't like being tied down to only one option; LDS' only. Now, dont get me wrong, i'm friends with the local LDS here, and really do believe in supporting them, but when you have a 4 member family, and occassionally like buying a few smaller items for those in need, price is everything; but full MSRP? Come on guys

-----

Mike.

 

[jeraldjcook]

It is such a shame the world is coming to this money for nothing and cheaper is better attitude.

I think the vast majority of divers would agree that we need LDSs and want to support them. But when they are selling a mask I want for $120, and I can get it online for $60 + shipping, I can't help feeling like I'm being taken advantage of. Would I pay $90 for the mask in order to support my LDS? Sure, but not double.

 

[RJTY]

I think the vast majority of divers would agree that we need LDSs and want to support them. But when they are selling a mask I want for $120, and I can get it online for $60 + shipping, I can't help feeling like I'm being taken advantage of. Would I pay $90 for the mask in order to support my LDS? Sure, but not double.

I can see your point in paying double. I am fortunate to have a LDS that does not take advantage of me like that. Its not only scuba. I am very frustated that society (seems to me) has gone too far on this internet shopping craze. I get hundreds of emails a week. Buy this cheap!! It seems that saving a buck or making a buck is more important than good old fashion service and hard work. For me, I would have rather have somebody EARN my business with customer service, knowledge, and personality. Not just give it too the cheapest price tag around. To a point, I was pleased the some of the major suppliers and organizations were holding out on principle instead of selling out.

 

[RV]

...snip... Do you buy your groceries on line? Lets all start doing that and push the local grocery stores out too....snip....

I'd love that, as long as the delivery was fast. I think some grocery stores are starting to do this now anyway. You go online to your local grocery store, pick what you want, and they deliver it, that day. In this case I don't see it driving the price down at all. In fact, just the opposite.

 

[fire_diver]

It is such a shame the world is coming to this money for nothing and cheaper is better attitude. Do you buy your groceries on line? Lets all start doing that and push the local grocery stores out too. What started out as a good information source has turned into a beast for get rich people for nothing that are not willing to put in a little old fashon hard work and the cheap consumers have fallen for the bait.

You seem pretty short sighted. When SCUBA was young, everything was mail order. Most people bought their tanks, regs, etc. from a local hardware or sporting goods store. Most also got their tanks filled from a compressor out back of the same store.

Then, as SCUBA became more popular, shops started opening just for SCUBA divers, to serve all their needs of training, equipment and service.

Later, when the LDS became the ONLY place for anything SCUBA, the prices went up and up, and manufacturers started saying "if you sell below $xxx then we wont let you sell our product, but it's for your own good"

Then came the internet, and people started to find that they can find product "A" cheaper from someone across the country, and the internet sales of scuba began.

I can buy parts to repair or upgrade my car from a dozen local stores or from the internet. I can do the same with camera equipment, or reloading supplies. The SCUBA industry is holding onto an outdated model, that hurts everyone. The dives shops that sell at the allowed prices lose customers. Customers who buy from them lose money. People who buy online are excommunicated by the industry and many, many LDS'. If the LDS was allowed to set thier own price, and sell online if they wanted to without interference from the manufacturers, then everyone benifits. Even the manufacturers would benefit, because more, people would buy new instead used ebay items. People would probably upgrade more often since the prices would be cheaper also. All this would be more sales and more money for the manufacturers, but they are too stubborn to see this.

FD

 

[PhilEllis]

......... frustated that society (seems to me) has gone too far on this internet shopping craze. I get hundreds of emails a week. Buy this cheap!! It seems that saving a buck or making a buck is more important than good old fashion service and hard work. For me, I would have rather have somebody EARN my business with customer service, knowledge, and personality. Not just give it too the cheapest price tag around. To a point, I was pleased the some of the major suppliers and organizations were holding out on principle instead of selling out.

Hey RJTY.......I know exactly how you feel. It always happens here in the United States. We went way too far on that automobile craze too......horses, a good buggy, and 3 town employees to pick up the poop were good enough.

I understand your frustration. We all hate to see change, but can't wait until it gets there. Maybe you simply have the wrong impression about internet stores, and internet scuba stores in particular.........

As I type this, I am looking out on my crew here in our store. It certainly looks like they are working hard. I know for a fact that they have good personality and provide excellent service. I would put their knowledge of the scuba product up against ANYONE IN THE RETAIL SCUBA INDUSTRY. This doesn't mean they are particularily special.....it's their job to have the requisite knowledge of our products. To cut to the chase, we think we earn our money here through "good old fashioned service and hard work". (My employees sometimes accuse me of not working hard enough....but I do put in 80 hours a week. I think that counts for something).

We cannot lament change in general. And we can't lament change in the scuba industry. Everyone would benefit if the local scuba store would make the change instead of fighting what is bound to come. Anyway, just my opinion.

Phil Ellis

 

[jeraldjcook]

I'd love that, as long as the delivery was fast. I think some grocery stores are starting to do this now anyway. You go online to your local grocery store, pick what you want, and they deliver it, that day. In this case I don't see it driving the price down at all. In fact, just the opposite.

When my sister lived in NYC, she actually could order her groceries online. I'm not sure which store it was, but she could go online, buy her groceries (it was somewhat limited in selection though), and they would deliver it to her apartment. It was a local store of course.

 

[RV]

When my sister lived in NYC, she actually could order her groceries online. I'm not sure which store it was, but she could go online, buy her groceries (it was somewhat limited in selection though), and they would deliver it to her apartment. It was a local store of course.

exactly...

Along with being a walk in store, the local grocery stores would be distribution centers too. With hoards of "Dominos" like delivery drivers screeching out from the back loading doc.

 

[mike_s]

Well, I agree that PADI is acknowledging what is already happening. But at least they are embracing it instead of resisting it. If not, they would get left behind in it's dust. Now I'm not a "go padi" person, but for the industry as a whole I think this is a positive change.

I wonder how many 'brick-n-mortar-only' shops that are PADI and don't do any internet sales will this piss off though? I'm sure plenty, but it's the same ones that need to change themselves.

2. Embrace the Net: The modern retailer is not likely to survive trying to pretend the internet isn’t there.

Boy, Aqualung needs to read this clearly. Otherwise they are doomed. They make a good product, but they are already being left behind by many other high-end manufacturers. Question is will they admit they are wrong and change or be hard-headed and go down with their ship? I expect the later.

It is such a shame the world is coming to this money for nothing and cheaper is better attitude. Do you buy your groceries on line? Lets all start doing that and push the local grocery stores out too.

Actually the originator of this post, Phil Ellis, is a perfect example of your post about grocery stores. He ran a small local dive shop in a medium sized town that is hours away from the ocean. It's obvious that sales were not huge in this envronment. Just like a small grocery store trying to compete with the new big-brand stores in town or any internet grocery store. Here, people could go online and buy the same scuba gear for 20% to 40% cheaper. It makes it hard for him to compete. He could either suffer from the internet or use it to his advantage. Now he operates a very successfull local store and internet commerce site. For his local customers, they can now get internet pricing at a walk-up local dive shop. For everyone else, they great prices remotely/online and still get can get great customer service. It's the best of both worlds.

You'll find several dive shops that have chosen this model and are thriving because of it. Scubatoys, Dive Sports, and more. Some have just seen the change before the others. Ironically, within a 1 hour drive of me, we've had 4 local dive shops go out of business in roughly the past year. Almost 10 failed LDS's within 1 hour drive in the past 10 years. They couldn't compete in the changing business model. It's that simple.

When my sister lived in NYC, she actually could order her groceries online. I'm not sure which store it was, but she could go online, buy her groceries (it was somewhat limited in selection though), and they would deliver it to her apartment. It was a local store of course.

I would actually pay extra for that. We pretty much buy the same things every week anyway. start with a standard online list, edit it slightly per week as needed, click submit and bill my credit card and the grocerys show up at the time I requested on my order. I'd pay an extra few bucks for this.

 

[jviehe]

I think the main barrier to local shopping is price and selection. However, diving is a social sport, and many of my shops customers just come in to chat, and maybe they buy something. Some are happy to pay more just because they like us. That being said, prices are outrageous, and if we simply lowered them, people wouldnt need the internet, except for when they wanted a specific item.

I also think dive shops could act more in a Pawn Shop role. Many divers like to buy used stuff, and there is a market for it.