Kelvin Grove Council meeting Tuesday Sept 8

[TheWetRookie]

For those who are able to make it, please attend the next Council meeting in Lions Bay. This meeting is open to all public including you and me.

Tuesday, September 8th, 2009 at 7pm in Council Chambers. Council Chambers are located at 400 Centre Rd, behind the Village Office, next to the Village Hall.

Be polite, be professional.

 

[paddledive]

For those who are able to attend Tuesday's Council meeting, can we agree to meet 1 hour earlier (6pm) at the Kelvin Grove parking lot?

This will give us an opportunity to organize ourselves and nominate a speaker. I REALLY don't want to be the speaker for several reasons (including my line of work) that I will explain in person.

 

[DaleC]

If I can arrange a sitter I will attend.

I had the same idea of just listening in to familiarize myself with the council and gain a sense of the local "voice" on the issue. My hope would be that a dialogue could develop with "someone" or at least we will know that a full on legal challenge is required.

 

[sunkmail]

Just a thought/suggestion for those that are able to attend ...

Even if you are planning to only listen and learn, select a speaker that is willing to stand up and formally ask for the opportunity to make a presentation stating our case at a (reasonable) later date. Or informally after the meeting - I have never atteneded a town meeting, so I don't know the protocols for public comments.

Obviously this would only be needed if they decide to either ignore the issue (ie, not talk about it) or if they decide to maintain the ban. This would give a chance for a proper presentation to be developed, legal consultation, etc, as well as showing that we are a serious group willing to be professional and respect the process.

 

[paddledive]

Following Sunkmail's good advise; can we please agree to meet at 6pm at the Kelvin Grove parking lot to organize ourselves and select a representative from our group?

I have sent an email to the Sr Admin of Lions Bay (Anne Page) asking that we be put on the agenda for Tuesday's Council meeting. So that part ought to be taken care of...I hope.

I have cut&copied this advise from a friend of mine. Can we try to hash out as many of these details before we meet on Tuesday?

1. Are we on the agenda? (Yes, done by me on Sept 4)
2. What precisely do we want to say, and how?
3. What do we know about the precise complaints that have been made? What evidence did council have before it other than anecdotal complaint?
4. What steps, if any, has council made to communicate with the dive community?
5. What efforts have the dive community made to communicate with Lions Bay.
6. What are we as divers prepared to offer to the community to address whatever legitimate concerns it may have?

Bottom line: the key to effective advocacy is to get facts, and present them clearly. If we are serious about reversing this, my suggestion is not simply to show up at a meeting, but to do our homework first and show up well armed.

 

[Sintax604]

1. Are we on the agenda? (Yes, done by me on Sept 4)
2. What precisely do we want to say, and how?
3. What do we know about the precise complaints that have been made? What evidence did council have before it other than anecdotal complaint?
4. What steps, if any, has council made to communicate with the dive community?
5. What efforts have the dive community made to communicate with Lions Bay.
6. What are we as divers prepared to offer to the community to address whatever legitimate concerns it may have?

I suspect that this will be one of the main issues discussed at this meeting. They will be scrambling to save face now that the media has become involved.

1. Good job.
2. We will probably only need to present a brief outline of WHY their bylaw is unlawful (I'm sure they are well aware of it by now), request that it be removed and offer a few suggestions to make the residents happy.
3. The main issues involve rowdy behaviour, public drinking (obviously not us), people getting changed and/or urinating in the parking lot (there may be photographic evidence), alleged insufficient room in the parking lot for residents. Complaints are from a few (hopefully a minority) of the residents who's houses overlook the parking area.
4. There is a sign posted restricting divers from changing in the parking lot. Otherwise there has been no communication with divers until WE started to challenge the bylaw.
5. To my knowledge, our only interactions with the community have be on an individual basis at the dive site - hopefully everyone has been friendly.
6. In a letter to Councillor Akerhielm, I made the following suggestions:
-consider installing a pay parking machine like the ones found at Porteau Cove and Stanley park - this will ensure that ALL parking lot users always pay for parking as there will be no confusion associated with going to the marina to pay. If lack of parking really is an issue, street parking could be allowed all the way down to the cul-de-sac at the park entrance and be part of the pay parking area. If The Village doesn't have the resources for this, I believe Impark can be contracted to maintain/enforce parking regulations. Additionally, revenue from parking can be used to maintain the park and even enhance existing facilities.

-consider upgrading the current washroom facilities (using parking revenue) to include a changing area. This would benefit ALL users of the park/beach and hopefully eliminate changing in the parking lot.

-as an inexpensive alternative, a "blind" could be installed in the parking lot consisting of nothing more than a single wall or row of trees/hedges where people could change out of sight from residents.

-as a bare minimum, parking/diving should be permitted during "non-peak" times/seasons such as evenings and during fall/winter months when the beach and park are not used by swimmers and sun bathers.

That's all I've got.

I'll be there at 6... unless anybody wants to meet at 4 and get a dive in first?

 

[joolz]

I'll be there at 6... unless anybody wants to meet at 4 and get a dive in first?

I can't tell if you're kidding or not, but violating the existing bylaw isn't a good way to demonstrate our willingness to compromise. The message it sends is: "We want you to change your bylaws, but if you don't, we'll just ignore them anyway."

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Perhaps me meant a dive somewhere else ... diving at KG right now would definitely not help your cause.

... Bob (G

 

[joolz]

Just as I hit "post" it occurred to me that Sintax meant scoring an invite from Rafe Mair and diving as a "guest", but even that would be inadvisable since it mocks the spirit of the bylaw (as petty as it is). There's a time for diplomacy and a time for activism, and I'd suggest this council meeting is the former.

If that doesn't get us anywhere -- and there's a good chance it won't -- then we can start making a mockery of their stupid bylaws by diving as Rafe's "guests".

 

[Sintax604]

Just as I hit "post" it occurred to me that Sintax meant scoring an invite from Rafe Mair and diving as a "guest", but even that would be inadvisable since it mocks the spirit of the bylaw (as petty as it is). There's a time for diplomacy and a time for activism, and I'd suggest this council meeting is the former.

If that doesn't get us anywhere -- and there's a good chance it won't -- then we can start making a mockery of their stupid bylaws by diving as Rafe's "guests".

You hit it right on there.

As much as I'd love to show them that divers can be (and generally are) respectable creatures who can live in harmony with the residents, I guess the day of the meeting may not be the best time to show it.

Let it be known, however that IDC has been sending people to Kelvin as much as possible since this whole thing began. Apparently nobody has been fined and no stink has been raised so far.

I can't wait until this is all done and we can just go back to enjoying what we do, without worrying about breaking laws and pissing people off.

I really look forward to meeting everyone involved on Tuesday.