Isle Royale fatality - Michigan

[FinnMom]

I agree that bent is not necessarly something you can fix and with good, vigilant surface support sending a badly stricken diver up may be the only reasonable option.
60m in Lk Superior conditions is seriously deep. I suspect that if you have a major incident at that depth, esp. if you were not already on your way up, any good outcome is unlikely.

 

[MalibuJerry]

fdog, I was responding to your categorical statement that you can't see sending someone to the surface after all "rescue from depth isn't that hard." If you had (hypothetical here) a 2 hour obligation and you followed that dictum you would be likely be victim No. 2. Therefore it is not obvious that sending him to the surface without taking him there was the wrong thing to do. It might well have been the best thing to do lest there be two or three fatalities instead of one.

If I only had 15 minutes of deco, I would feel comfortable blowing it off or taking a diver to the surface and then returning to do some in-water re-compression. If I had a long deco to do such that I would most likely have explosive decompression taking him to the surface, then taking someone to the surface is a bad decision and is not indicated by the situation.

Since we don't know their dive profile at the time of the incident, it is wrong to criticize their decision making. Perhaps you have never had long deco obligations or read about some who have blown them off (the Rouses for example), but not doing them is a critical mistake. This is one of the hazards of deep and long, you can't take someone to the surface no matter how much you might like to.

 

[fdog]

<sigh>

I am sorry I offended you so.



Of course, any situation needs to be evaluated in situ. A generalization "always do this" usually isn't universally applicable....and that is what I was responding to....that deco obligation necessitates sending the stricken diver to the surface.

If you evaluate the cases where victims - tox, CO2, etc - are sent to the surface, they perish from the barotrauma of the trip (as well as the lack of deco). Hence, generally speaking, sending an obligated diver on a buoyant, unaccompanied ascent is a death sentence.

So, I will darn sure make every effort at saving my buddy before I write them off by sending them to the surface. They would do the same for me. If it ever became so dire that it was "them or me", then I'd make the difficult decision and send them.

As for deco, it would be simply nuts to blow off a 2 hour obligation. We all know that. But on a short, plain-vanilla 200' dive, you bet I'd chop it in half if it meant saving my buddy. Of course it's going to hurt, but that's part of the risks in this game. As for the hypothetical 2 hour deco, I would move quickly through the deep stops and dwell shallow, where I could send up a yellow bag or there's plenty of other options.

Anyway. Sorry if I offended you.


All the best, James

 

[flots am]

They attempted to assist him but were forced to send him to the surface alone after he became unconscious.

I don't get that part. Unconcious just means that he won't be awake for the deco stops and a gas switch is going to be a problem, but it isn't a reason to just sent him "up".

flots.

 

[MalibuJerry]

James, you didn't offend me, I was just making a point. You are right though, if you have to send a team member to the surface from 200+' unaccompanied, you are just doing a body recovery. But if he is not breathing, even in your scenario you won't get him to the surface in time. By the time you get to a point where you can send up a "help me bag" and someone responds, he is not going to make it. This is just an it's terrible and sucks situation.

But the point is, we do not know enough to evaluate the decision making for this particular dive.
Jerry

---------- Post added July 16th, 2013 at 04:16 PM ----------

I don't get that part. Unconcious just means that he won't be awake for the deco stops and a gas switch is going to be a problem, but it isn't a reason to just sent him "up".

flots.

Flots, if he were unconscious and holding the regulator in his mouth and breathing, you could do that. It does not seem a likely scenario. Generally when someone goes unconscious the regulator falls out of the mouth and they drown. But if he were breathing and all you were doing was skipping his gas switches, then you could bring him up. That is the procedure for someone who has an Ox Tox. Keep the regulator in their mouth and do all of the deco stops on the way to the surface. I doubt if that was the case here, but we don't know that yet.

 

[tim]

Please everyone, remember this is a VERY remote dive site. About 350 mi from the nearest chamber. While I am not close friends with those involved, but I know all were capable and experienced Lake Superior divers. What I have read in the media is different from the second hand account I heard locally for what that is worth. Water temp would have been 37 deg top to bottom. I believe they were OC.

My thoughts go out to Lloyd's family and to the others involved.

 

[PfcAJ]

Imo, if your deco is long enough that you can't go to the surface to bring someone up and then re-descend, you need in-water support.

 

[peterbj7]

First I've ever heard that said.