Insane hand signals Thumbs Up = Bad

[riguerin]

Everytime I see a shaka, I think it's a combination of "problem" and the thumb. No worries- I know what what it means, I just don't use it myself.

You could always throw down some horns ... but then you might run the risk of offending people from Mediterranean descent. YMMV

 

[do it easy]

Who knew that diving was so politically complex?

 

[Sam Miller III]

Read these posts with interest...All are good and some what logical but miss the mark.

The very first verified Underwater Signaling system was developed by SCUBA club called the Sea Sabres (SS) in a pool in North Long Beach California in the very early 1950s. The president Bob Reutherford discovered a need for an effective UW signaling system and the club developed one over a series of dives and pool sessions. Bob was an ex WW11 USAF type, I was a ex USAF Captain so we relied on USAF signals--however, thumbs up indicated "Assend"--a foot or all the way to the surface.

So Walter was for once correct "thumbs up" means assend.

In 1954 the SS signaling system was printed in a booket format and 5000 copies were distributed through out the world's known diving community.

A copy and article by Bob was printed in part in the now defunct Water World magazine in 1955.

A few years later a US government grant was issued to an easten college to develope an effective UW signaling system--they copied the Sea Signaling System almost in total--and received $$$$ for their efforts!

In October 1956 the USN released part 3 of Navships 250-538 ( I recall that being the number--correct Walter?) which as I recall was titled "Self contained diving." This document introduced and incorporated the Sea Sabres Signaling system in to the USN document--you are ivited to fig.3-16 page 19 "Lets go up."

In 1968-9 the late Ralph Ericksen (son?) copied the Sea Sabre signaling system in total and produced an Offical PADI document as the Offical PADI signaling system and marketed it to the members. The Sea Sabres Signaling System was never protected by any legal document - I would bet the PADI document is...

About 15 years ago I had a column, "The way it was" in the now defunct Discover Divingmagazine. One of my articles was the Sea Sabre Signaling System...It covered the history of UW hand signaling as I have described above, and of course a little about Bob Ruetherford--who gave the world and appeared on national TV for UW Christmas trees & Christmas parties, Easter egg hunts and much more...Bob has been diving in the big reef in the sky for a long time --

Yes "thumbs up" has indicated from the very beginning assend--a foot or all the way to the surface--nothing more nothing less
Now you know the rest of the story,

SDM

 

[diver 85]

In my book (when you're not underwater), thumbs up simply means 'good'....of course not everyone reads my book....UW it means to ascend but not to any particular level, you have to indicate to what depth you're referring to ie 20', 15', surface(boat) etc etc....Please don't make this complicated...lol......

 

[rottielover]

Interesting read...

I was taught that Thumbs up means ascend until the "level off" or "stay at this depth" sign was given, if that sign was not given, that means your slowly ascending to the surface...

If you want to indicate "let's go up and do our saftey stop" I was taught to use the right hand to give the thumbs up, and then take your left hand open palm down and then move the right hand so that your thumb hits the center of your open palm (as if hitting an overhead).

Too bad I don't have my digital cam handy, I could take some picks of an U/W conversation I had with my DM on Maui,, It went something like this

Me to DM: I'm at turn pressure, I have (whatever it was I had, let's say 1000psi for this example)
DM to Me: OK, do you see the boat?
Me to DM: OK, the boat is that way, my buddy and I are heading for saftey stop
DM to ME: OK
Me to DM: OK
Me to Buddy: Let's go do our stop, follow me, OK
Buddy to Me: OK

Let's see now, Turn Pressure sign was breifed before the dive, I think most people usually use this sign for "1/2 tank" but on this dive it was to mean turn. Take left hand open palm up and place your right hand (open) with the pinky edge across the middle of your open left palm, as if cutting your left hand in half (pinky to thumb) with your right.

Boat: Cup both hands into a V shape

Do you see? / Look : point to your eyes with forefinger and middle finger

That way: Point!

Hope this makes sense...

There are also a few signs you can use for various wildlife...

Shark : Make a shark fin with your hand on your forehead
Turtle: Make a fist with both hands and place your right hand on top of your left, extend your thumbs and then rotate your thumbs in a circle

And of course the diver that kicked me in the head got the "your #1 in my book" sign (I won't describe that one)

 

[tedtim]

An interesting read. I note that most of the responders are from the US. I did a search on the internet and found a few sites that provide some information regarding the origin of the thumbs up signal.

http://bernd.wechner.info/Hitchhiking/Thumb/ (a number of connotations for it here)

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/thumbs-up.html

http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1511/is_n12_v17/ai_18938015 (some background on the interpretation, or misinterpretation from the days of the Roman empire)

http://www.themorningnews.org/archives/how_to/the_nonexpert_when_in_rome.php

While most of the view is that "thumbs up" means all is good, it is definitely not universal. When I last travelled through Heathrow airport they had a number of advertising posters illustrating that there could be different interpretations of the same symbol. The one that struck me as similar to this discussion is the hanging of a horse shoe. In one part of the world it is hung with the open end up, in another part of the world it is hung with the open part down. Both have the same connotation of good luck.

Another is holding up two fingers in the form of a "V." If the back of the hand is shown to another person with the two fingers held up in a "V" to some people of the world you are telling them off. To others it is the number two. So what does it mean under water, a number or you are telling your buddy to ....

As long as the sign has a universal meaning in SCUBA then why not adopt it accordingly?

 

[MatWill]

And of course the diver that kicked me in the head got the "your #1 in my book" sign (I won't describe that one)

sounds like our 100 bar at night sign.. (middle finger upright into the torch)

no you dont need to tell me your at 100 bar more then once on a dive!

to the op.. it happens ALL the time, i usually just give the OK back then the ascend sign till the offending party makes up there mind on what they want to do, usually involving shacking the head and lots of bubbles and some OK signs!!

sometimes people just cant help it, when i show someone something really cool underwater and they give a giant double thumbs up. we always have a good laugh back on the boat

 

[ianr33]

So what does a thumbs up mean in a cave when you have been at the same depth for the last 20 minutes? I know what it means to me.

 

[Sam Miller III]

So what does a thumbs up mean in a cave when you have been at the same depth for the last 20 minutes? I know what it means to me.

_______________________________________________________________
Hit your head on the top?

The first book on cave diving "Caves and Cave diving" by Guy de Lavaur. pub in 1956. I somehow fell certain that you have read it and recall they did not have signals incorporated into their armentarium of diving.

Remember the Sea Sabre Underwater signaling is a pure American (USA) invention and had just been presented two years earlier. In that era and even earlier the French had the attitude that all things diving must be French and it some what was, Champion, Squale, US Divers, etc...now the only current equipment I can reacall that is French is Jet Fins

One would assume that by now the Cave diving community had a signal for up,
Since you have 4 long years of diving perhaps you would be so kind as to advise the public as to the signal?

SDM

 

[cmufieldhockey8]

One would assume that by now the Cave diving community had a signal for up,
Since you have 4 long years of diving perhaps you would be so kind as to advise the public as to the signal?

SDM

My NSS Cavern Diving Manual says the thumbs up sign means "surface" which means the dive is over and "all divers then exit the cavern in an ordely fashion."

The "up" sign is putting your palm facing up and moving your hand up. It is "used to indicate up within the cavern in place of the traditional open-water signs in order to avoid any possible confusion with the surface command."