I'm the Pariah again

[vladimir]

in post #156, you attributed what I wrote to Tigerman, and I am guessing it was a typo, which is why I put in the smiley face.



I am not trying to antagonize you, but I sense that I am. I was not trying to put words into your mouth, and based on your response, I probably did not understand correctly.

Sorry, no, my mistake. I was confused, but not antagonized. Just...stirred up—I edited it already.

 

[AaronRiot]

I would like to hear about an incident where a buddy was lost, trapped underwater, and rescued by a search initiated from the surface. Think of the logistics. Even if a search was mounted immediately (divers geared up and standing by?), how long would it take to find the buddy that the buddy couldn't find? How often does a diver get trapped underwater? On a Caribbean reef? It's not an impossible scenario, it's just incredibly unlikely.

A lost buddy could imply many different scenarios I think.

-Yes there could be an issue underwater.
-Yes they could have ditched you and went to the boat.
- They also could have lost you, and in an attempt to head back to the boat swam the other way. How many threads have there been of a lost group/diver drifting away and left by the boat that couldn't find them.

Point is, a lost buddy is just that. Lost. You don't know what has happened...otherwise you'd still be together.

My next point, if you buddy up on the boat... unless you're 'same ocean'... then you've made a commitment to lookout for the other guy.

Third point, just because in your vast experience it's never happened, it's pretty irresponsible to assume that it won't.

I'd rather dive with someone who acted on a false emergency rather than doing nothing in a real one.

I'm in this boat.

 

[vladimir]

A lost buddy could imply many different scenarios I think.

-Yes there could be an issue underwater.
-Yes they could have ditched you and went to the boat.
- They also could have lost you, and in an attempt to head back to the boat swam the other way. How many threads have there been of a lost group/diver drifting away and left by the boat that couldn't find them.

Point is, a lost buddy is just that. Lost. You don't know what has happened...otherwise you'd still be together.

My next point, if you buddy up on the boat... unless you're 'same ocean'... then you've made a commitment to lookout for the other guy.

Third point, just because in your vast experience it's never happened, it's pretty irresponsible to assume that it won't.



I'm in this boat.

You missed the point. The scenario that the OP used to justify his urgency was that his buddy might be trapped underwater and exhausting his gas. That is an incredibly unlikely scenario. Nobody is arguing against taking responsibility for your buddy.

I am not even arguing that you should ignore that 1/100th of 1% scenario, but you do have to put it into perspective. Acting to rescue somebody who doesn't need rescue creates a new set of risks, as it did for the OP. Do the cost/benefit anaylsis.

 

[redacted]

....In Matt's situation, if his buddy had been in trouble, I think we would be having a different discussion since his actions would have likely engaged a lost diver search sooner rather than later, and perhaps the diver would have been found before OOA (such as in a case that the diver was stuck). So, I don't see anything wrong with his actions in the water, even though many of us would have acted differently (back to my point that I am not aware of any standard protocol for this).

The only issue I have with Matt's actions, is back on the boat. Once the primary fear of the buddy being in trouble was put to rest, it is time to swallow some pride and apologize if your improvised lost diver protocol was not appropriate.

Not quite. In fact, Matt's actions would have delayed a search had one been necessary. While he initially followed normal protocol of search for 1 minute and then surface; he then decided to descend again and resume his own search. He does not indicate how long he persisted in that fruitless endeavor before he resurfaced and had more communications problems.

 

[jonnythan]

Not quite. In fact, Matt's actions would have delayed a search had one been necessary.

Exactly, and I said so earlier in this thread. Matt needed to communicate "lost buddy" to the captain and basically made no attempt to do so.

 

[diverrex]

Not because he second guessed himself at the surface, but rather when you examine the OP's post in it's entirety (as well as some of his previous posts) that it becomes painfully obvious that this guy is no resque diver and shouldn't be construed as such by unsuspecting divers around him. (or himself for that matter)

I agree completely with this sentiment.

 

[vladimir]

Don't be a dick.

Is this considered civil discourse in Colorado? There are at least a couple of you who seem to think so.

 

[Mike]

Is this considered civil discourse in Colorado? There's at least a couple of you who seem to think so.

Colorado is filled with real people, we talk, act and carry on like normal people not fake ones.




I'd choose Matt as my dive buddy before I'd chose the guy who was his buddy on this dive.

If I ran into a problem it's obvious Matt would take actions to try to help me, as opposed to the other guy, who'd just go get on the boat and have a soda.

I'd much rather dive with somebody who errs on safety then ignores lost buddy procedures or makes assumptions that might turn out to cost me my life. You can hope for the best, but you better be taking actions for the worst.

 

[nimoh]

Not quite. In fact, Matt's actions would have delayed a search had one been necessary. While he initially followed normal protocol of search for 1 minute and then surface; he then decided to descend again and resume his own search. He does not indicate how long he persisted in that fruitless endeavor before he resurfaced and had more communications problems.

I forgot about that part, thanks awap....i agree.

 

[vladimir]

Colorado is filled with real people, we talk, act and carry on like normal people not fake ones.

You act like asses, apparently.

See, "ass" is more acceptable in civil society, which I guess you don't mix with very often.